r/TooAfraidToAsk May 26 '22 Silver 1 Hugz 1

Do you think Homophobia will ever end in Africa? Sexuality & Gender

I am a human rights defender, and refugee rights advocate living in Kakuma refugee camp Kenya. I'm facing extreme persecutions and Homophobia. My parents chased me away from home after they discovered that am Lgbti. I have gone through the worst. I was pushed into a long ditch by Homophobic Refugees and my bones got broken and dislocated... We need more advocacy dear Friends. I'm threatened on daily, denied services some times and they want to poison me. I need a safe place I can stay. Is being who you are a crime?

221 Upvotes

60

u/[deleted] May 26 '22

As education levels rise and religious levels fall (not ENTIRELY correlated, but quite heavily), yes, eventually. Will take decades though, at least.

14

u/agent_pecan May 27 '22

Religious groups have taken huge chunks of Africa since 2020. Probably going to be waiting 100+ years now.

13

u/paulkanyamucanary May 27 '22

And religion has escalated homophobia

4

u/devinemomentsoftruth May 27 '22

I agree but significant proportion of educated people are homophobic too. Homophobia has it's roots burried deep into people's belief about a specific way humans should live/be when it is obvious that one can live their lives the way they think they should. Who is

I also think that sometimes people find it hard to accept how they or someone else are.

80

u/Busy_Promotion3656 May 26 '22

Sadly there isnt enough protection for lgbtqia people around the world. And where there is its not enough and took decades of fights and mistreatment. Im positive that africa will change to but its hard to tell when. Economic, political and religious change is neccesary and with corruption and bad democracy its harder, so the more liberal places will be more progressive. I cant tell you which nearby places are the best and an immigration to safer countries is dangerous. Hearing your story is sad and i wish you the best.

27

u/paulkanyamucanary May 26 '22

Thank you mate ...just know things are worse on my side. Rejection at home and also here, it hurts.

-26

u/fartssmellgreat May 27 '22

How do they know you’re gay?

0

u/xlr8inferno May 27 '22

Pasta told them.

0

u/Ok-Cryptographer786 May 27 '22

they probably talk in a forced high pitch voice and wear women's clothes. probably make a scene everywhere they go telling everyone who they have sex with.

17

u/unclefishbits May 26 '22

They are still stalking albino people in different villages, so there's a lot of work to do.

20

u/aeolus811tw May 27 '22

Unfortunately homophobia persist in every culture around the world, mostly due to the social construct and traditional education that have been established for thousands of years.

The only difference is whether a society is progressive enough ensure the rights of LGBT+ group, but that does not mean the discrimination has been eliminated.

Africa probably just need more time to allow education and awareness to grow. Though that probably won’t happen anytime soon.

8

u/Heayohello May 26 '22

I hope it will and everywhere that needs it. Africa and Middle East will move slow to it. I’m sorry you went through that though. I hope you’ve recovered.

6

u/paulkanyamucanary May 26 '22

Not really, I'm still facing Homophobia in full swing. Threats after threats. I wish I can get means nd I exit this Homophobic place. We've lost 4 Lgbti refugees due to homophobia in this same place. 😥😥

5

u/GeorgeMcCrate May 27 '22

Have they been murdered? Is there any way you can find refuge in different country and leave where you are now?

5

u/paulkanyamucanary May 27 '22

Yes four died due to homophobia.. Exiting here requires funds. Unfortunately

2

u/GeorgeMcCrate May 27 '22

I’m very sorry to hear that. I hope you always stay safe. My I ask what kind of refuge that place is? Because if people can just come in from outside and kill people then it doesn’t seem much like a refuge to me.

3

u/paulkanyamucanary May 27 '22

The camp is called Kakuma Refugee camp, it is in KENYA. You can dm me I tell more information about the camp and the living situation, if you so wish kindly..🙏

2

u/jaymoothie May 27 '22

Can you try and move to South Africa? It’s the only country in Africa where you can openly be part of the LGBTQI+ community.

3

u/paulkanyamucanary May 27 '22

No resources to move. It is kinda expensive. 😩

1

u/Soft_Internal3206 May 27 '22

Maybe you can try contacting those NGO'S that support LGBTI, maybe they can assist you, I mean 4 people have been killed because they are lgbti?

1

u/paulkanyamucanary May 27 '22

Yes they have been killed because of being Lgbti

1

u/Soft_Internal3206 May 28 '22

Sorry to hear that.

0

u/Electrical-Farm-8881 May 27 '22

Maybe you can swim

17

u/toody931 May 27 '22

One of the great crimes of human justice organizations is the strange willingness to simultaneously ignore, fetishize, demonize and infantalize the developing world. Many organizations are scared to call out underdeveloped nations or treat them like it's impossible to have acceptance and poor economic conditions at the same time

And, like most things involving Africa nowadays, alot of that conservative nature can somewhat be traced back to the spread of organized religions via colonialism. Of course, this isn't exclusive to Christianity or Islam, but alot of the problems form there

So how do we fix it? Part of it is simply economic progress, decolonization and better awareness. But I think it's important to raise awareness and make moves towards grassroots organizations in these country with emphasis on political action

8

u/FrodoTbaggens May 27 '22

As they say "This is Africa".

6

u/SectorEducational460 May 27 '22

End entirely. Probably not, it hasn't ended in the west either. If you mean reduce to the point where the hate exist but it's quite sporadic. Then possibly but it will take decades. First economic needs must be met at a minimum. Heavy push for secularism as religion is often a massive driver towards discrimination over the opinion of sky daddy. Raising women's role in the society beyond meagre housewives. All of this will take decades even a couple of centuries.

4

u/khalilfustan May 27 '22

What do you mean by “Africa”? Subsaharan? I unfortunately do not think it will ever end, no. Possibly in 300-400 years, sure.

3

u/Electrical-Farm-8881 May 27 '22

Most of Africa is homophobic except maybe South Africa

2

u/[deleted] May 27 '22

Life is too harsh for people to put effort into social issues. And I’m pretty well off in Nigeria, but life is still harsh compared to the US/Europe

2

u/MyLifeFrAiur May 26 '22

it's not gonna be easy, i have an african friend who moved to Europe got european education nice job with european wife, still looks disgusted when we mention gay

1

u/paulkanyamucanary May 26 '22

Oh goshhhhhh He probably isn't gay.

2

u/Spicymunchkin98 May 31 '22

Or in denial, pretending to live the straight life

1

u/jamie278 May 26 '22

Yes obviously. Just not in your lifetime unfortunately. Keep in mind homophobia was brought to Africa by colonialism and even right now extreme white american evangelicals are influencing homophobic policies in places like Uganda. So we need to condemn them and the politicians who pushed them.

Also remember Africa is a continent not a country and its not monolithic either. Although not perfect but there are some places in Africa improving. Some African states like Lesotho, São Tomé and Príncipe, Mozambique, the Seychelles, Angola, and Botswana have abolished sodomy laws in recent years. Some outlawing anti-lgbt discrimination.

Again not perfect but it will get there.

3

u/thatonemisty May 27 '22

Lmao ur first paragraph seems like a real cap

5

u/toody931 May 27 '22

I wouldn't say homophobia is uniquely colonial, it was equally a problem in Africa as anywhere else, there just wasn't a power structure behind it pre colonialism. Although the outside influence is truly what propping up modern laws, interpersonal homophobia has deeper roots

1

u/AmunPharaoh May 27 '22

Exactly. This person seems to think 'Africa' is some tiny island with one singular society living there as well.

9

u/paulkanyamucanary May 26 '22

You are right... I wish all countries abolish such harsh anti gay laws and they decriminalize homosexuality...😥🏳️‍🌈🏳️‍🌈

2

u/jamie278 May 26 '22

Yeah it is sad. But unfortunately good progress takes soo much time that we have no choice. In the mean time we need to support the activists who are pushing for good change.

2

u/paulkanyamucanary May 26 '22

Glad there are some more Organizations coming up...they are helping with sensitizing the masses about Gender and Sexuality. 🏳️‍🌈

0

u/jamie278 May 26 '22 edited May 26 '22

Exactly. And it bother me when some say that lgbt is "un-African". People who say this clearly don't know their history of pre-colonial Africa. Not acting like it was a paradise but I can say confidently that being gay wasn't seen as a "sin"

6

u/paulkanyamucanary May 26 '22

President Museveni (Ugandas dictator) has always said homosexuality is "unafrican" Too bad. He is ignorant.

3

u/jamie278 May 26 '22

Yea a lot of African leaders are unfortunately. And corrupt too lol.

1

u/AmunPharaoh May 27 '22

Bro Africa isn't one monolithic society. Every tribe or nation had (and still has) different beliefs about it, and some saw it negatively long before colonial times. I can say for a FACT that getting buggered was seen as a bad thing for a few thousand years in my country before colonial times lol. We have ancient myths about it.

1

u/paulkanyamucanary May 26 '22

Absolutely! You are very right

1

u/Busy_Promotion3656 May 26 '22

I have question and you seem to have knowledge about it. I heard that far right homophobic people fled from countries who bevame more accepting to africa to push for more homophobia. Is this true and are these the evangelicals you ment?

-5

u/jamie278 May 26 '22

Yes unfortunately far right (mostly American) Christians realise that the fight for lgbt rights is a losing battle for them and so they go on "missionary trips " to African nations and push the anti-lgbt narrative. Not all of of course thankfully. But Uganda is the country I named because is the most egregious example becauseof the "kill the gay" bill.

But like I said it was colonialism that brought this attitude in Africa. Whether this be Christianity or Islam. Thankfully I haven't met any but I I did I certainly wouldn't want them here.

It will go away but its gonna take a long time. Afterall black people gaining rights in America didn't happen over night. That took centuries. And even then there is still a lot of work to do.

21

u/OfTheAtom May 26 '22

What? Homophobia existed in East Asia and Africa long before Europeans got there. Not every kingdom but most of them would have lethal consequences for it. There are a couple that were profoundly tolerant that have been recorded but most recorded nations in no way showed less animosity toward homosexuals, atleast men, than the rest of the planet

6

u/Beginning-Freedom567 May 27 '22

so easy to blame everything on poverty and white people. do you ever think any bad action taken in the world is anyones fault or is it always colonialism and white peoples fault?

1

u/Electrical-Farm-8881 May 27 '22

It is they build the world after all

1

u/Beginning-Freedom567 May 27 '22

somebody else could have “built the world” as you put it, but things didn’t shake out that way.

2

u/AmunPharaoh May 27 '22

I'd love to see your sources for any of this. I think you're making it up out of thin air because it's so patently incorrect.

Colonialism was shite and didn't help anyone but it is absolutely NOT where homophobia originated anywhere.

1

u/Busy_Promotion3656 May 26 '22

Thanks for the info

1

u/Pain4444 May 26 '22

200 years from now maybe. There are parts of Africa where people still believe in voodoo.

0

u/GucciMain77 May 27 '22

Will Americans ever stop mass shootings?

1

u/paulkanyamucanary May 27 '22

I'm worried, the trend might continue. Very sad.

-11

u/PigTenis May 26 '22

Not during your life. Deep social changes are needed, those dont come without stable economy.

Also half of your "question" is you using this 1,7m sub as a platform to talk about your experiences, what Africa needs and activism. Thats a dick move, its a question sub.

9

u/s7th6 May 26 '22

lmao this comment is the worst thing i've read on reddit in days and i've been talking to genuine nazis

-2

u/PigTenis May 26 '22

Well, all replies so far state decades so it just may be you being ignorant about reality of rural communities in developing countries. Wonder how those nazi debates went.

5

u/s7th6 May 26 '22

I was obviously referring to the second paragraph of your post you deranged degenerate sicko lmao

1

u/PigTenis May 27 '22 edited May 27 '22

Read the rules or gtfo back to nazis. Me liking someones point does not mean it belongs here. If I wanted to get posts about someones opinion, there are other subs for it with people comfortable seeing 20 of them in their feed. You can also go there to voice yours.

3

u/s7th6 May 27 '22

some innocent stranger on the internet: "hello please i am dying from persecution in a third world country could someone offer me a little bit of hope i was just wondering do you think this suffering will ever end? sorry as you can tell i am not very typical reddit poster :("

you, a serious intellectual redditeur: "umm wow how dare you push your agenda on my sub reddit i must say you are being a dick of the highest caliber if you actually read the rules of proper reddiquette you will learn that your behavior is quite inappropriate and i shall protect the sanctity of this noble platform by telling you to fuck off"

worst case of reddit brain I've ever seen. I'd tell you to get off the internet but at this stage it's probably terminal and there's no hope for you

2

u/PigTenis May 27 '22

.... you are a 4chan user.

1

u/xOneLeafyBoi May 27 '22

I don’t think it will ever end anywhere honestly. Some people will always hate or marginalize a group just because they’re different from them sadly

1

u/ObviouslyNoBot May 27 '22

Oh that's easy. We simply invite them to the EU and accomodate for their way of life and if anything happens we repeat that white supremacy and racism are the biggest threats.

1

u/paulkanyamucanary May 27 '22

I wish I can get to Europe and find safety..

1

u/casualblack_7 May 27 '22

this dudes profile is sooooo sus

0

u/Cunt4654 May 27 '22

homophobia, racism, all of the isms. they will never end, all you people caring to much about this shit is completely pointless as not everyone is going to be accepted by everyone no matter who you are.

-1

u/LoafOfRyeToast May 27 '22

well, they have different beliefs. Their homophobia is a part of their beliefs. It's possible to do it but it will take generations. It most likely will not it won't end. They probably see LGBTQ+ as foreign and unnatural.

1

u/el_mapache_negro May 26 '22

Ever is a long time

1

u/savethebros May 26 '22

No way. Not even the West will be free of homophobia.

1

u/horndoguwu May 26 '22

When life is better for them they'll probably work on that, more education, internet, shit like that

1

u/Crustybuttt May 27 '22

Probably, but not in our lifetimes

1

u/medosin May 27 '22

And there are some who think gay people would choose this kind of persecution.

1

u/JustNoLikeWhoa May 27 '22

As long as there is a difference, there will also remain a fear.

1

u/Acrobatic_End6355 May 27 '22

I have hope that it can and will improve. I don’t think it will ever be perfect, because there are people in every country that are unfortunately against people who are LGBTQIA. But it can get better.

1

u/Diedrightnow-_-437 May 27 '22

Definitely, but it will take a very long time for such a thing to happen.

1

u/[deleted] May 27 '22

The world will always have homophobia, racism and sexism because the world will always have hate and oppression.

1

u/jermguy117 May 27 '22

There are areas that believe in penis stealing wizards. So, I'm gonna say no to this one, chief.

1

u/FoundationNarrow6940 May 27 '22

Yeah but do you have proof there aren't penis stealing wizards? If you think they don't exist, it's only that much easier for them to steal your penis. Would you be joking about this if it were YOUR father, brother, son, who had his penis stolen?

1

u/jermguy117 May 27 '22

Sir, shut your goddamn mouth or I'll steal your penis. And I don't use magic😎

1

u/FoundationNarrow6940 May 27 '22

Are you more of a penis stealing rouge? Or a penis stealing knight?

I like to think of it like Runescape,

penis stealing wizards are weak to penis stealing rogues

penis stealing rogues are weak to penis stealing knights

penis stealing knights are weak to penis stealing wizards

1

u/jogamasta_ May 27 '22

Homophobia will never end like racism that will never end to

1

u/mustang6172 May 27 '22

I'm sure we'll find the cure someday.

1

u/cbrrydrz May 27 '22

Sure i give it 200 years.

1

u/bobturnner May 27 '22

Do I think all 54+ countries in Africa will all stop homophobia? Absolutely not.

1

u/PK-Kahugz May 27 '22

I don't think homophobia ends anywhere, just like racism... It just becomes harder for homophobes to show their true feelings / express themselves.

1

u/BreezyMAYDAY May 27 '22

I gotta ask though. Surely you did research on Kenya before you went? Why go from a bad situation( truely terrible of your family) to a place that is CLEARLY worse?

I cant imagine escaping to Africa from any situation can be an improvement. Things are tough here and only getting worse. People are poor and desperate. If it wasnt homophobia, it would have been xenophobia.

1

u/guswang May 27 '22

Is being who you are a crime?

In some places, yes.

You should try to go somewhere like Europe or US and seek asylum, that's the best change you have. Be safe.

2

u/paulkanyamucanary May 27 '22

Thank you friend...

1

u/guswang May 27 '22

No problem =)

1

u/nerdyless May 27 '22

I doubt that it could ever end. If anything it can only grow. It hard to leave a religious belief system when you’ve been raised around it ur hole life. And since America is starting to acquire the title of a Christian nation. I can see it joining in.

1

u/paulkanyamucanary May 27 '22

Terrible then ..

1

u/nerdyless May 27 '22

Yep. But it CAN be stopped if ppl can find a good enough argument to make someone leave their religion. And it’ll be hard for ppl to find it without being disrespectful so yea. Good luck.

1

u/paulkanyamucanary May 27 '22

Seems Christianity has done more harm than good

1

u/SwordGun May 27 '22

Hopefully no.

1

u/ScaryPhrase May 27 '22

I wonder if people are too quick to label things "phobias" and society caused, rather than consider that it may very well be natural animal instinct.

1

u/Markus-28 May 27 '22

People’s opinions and attitudes obviously fall on a spectrum. And there will always be people on the extreme ends of any topic you pick. In stead of seeking an end to peoples way of thinking, I suspect it’ll be more impactful to seek fairness and equal opportunities for all. In which case, yes, it is likely that there will come a time when people with different ideologies/ genders/ sexual orientation are treated fairly and given equal opportunity.

1

u/MrSteveBob May 27 '22

It’ll be a very slow process, but it will. Homosexuality was still demonised in even the most “progressive” societies less than 30 years ago. There is a light at the end of the tunnel, it’s just far away

1

u/WhenTheRiverRunsDeep May 27 '22

Give it 100 years, and probably.

1

u/gabremchd May 27 '22

honestly I don't think homophobia will ever end anywhere. homophobia is born from misoginy, and, you know, misoginy is one of the pillars of capitalism.

1

u/paulkanyamucanary May 27 '22

I just fuckin hate homophobia....😩😩😩😥

1

u/thetwitchy1 May 27 '22

Education tends to bring tolerance. It will not happen tomorrow, but it will happen.

Be strong and be safe.

1

u/AmunPharaoh May 27 '22

I think it is getting better in SOME areas of Africa but in others I have no idea if it will ever end. I have a couple Nigerian friends and both of them have randomly said that while their parents are against homosexuality, they personally don't care what other people do in the bedroom. So that's an improvement there. Same for me and other Egyptian people I know, most who are my age are a bit more progressive about that stuff. I suspect more will join us as time goes on but it will take many many years and some parts of the continent might never come round.

1

u/showgirl__ May 27 '22

No. For as long as there is a way to label different groups of people there will be someone discriminating against every one of them.

1

u/Possible-Leg-695 May 27 '22

It will never disappear from the world let alone africa. We are human beings after all

1

u/NapendaViatu May 27 '22

Lmao who tf named it KaKuma

1

u/paulkanyamucanary May 27 '22

Kenyans

1

u/NapendaViatu May 27 '22

Ig but it translates to the little pussy so i found that funny

1

u/ZerngCaith May 28 '22

I am really sorry you went through that, it is very unfair that happened to you.

Sadly, I do not see homophobia going away any time soon. LGBTQ+ rights are a very political issue and even in “The Land Of The Free” you tend to see fluctuating opinions on the same depending on the political atmosphere at the moment.

All I would say right now is just work hard and surround yourself with people who accept you for who you are. It will take time but those people exist. Take care.

1

u/paulkanyamucanary May 28 '22

Thank you so much 🥰

1

u/JennyNatalia May 29 '22

It’s still alive and well EVEN IN THE WEST. “End” is quite ambitious.

1

u/paulkanyamucanary May 30 '22

Am facing serious persecutions here

1

u/JennyNatalia May 30 '22

That’s sad. You have to be more secretive in Africa in order to be safe. In the West you can be more open and public about it, but the harassment doesn’t end. The difference is in Africa you can get mob justice,arrested, jailed or even killed for it. Best to stay low key and just try to live your life with your partner as best as you can

1

u/paulkanyamucanary May 30 '22

Thank you dear...

-4

u/Ansanm May 27 '22

Why would you ask such a question about a whole continent of 50 plus countries, different religions and cultures. South Africa has more freedoms in many areas than, say Egypt. Also, evangelists have made big gains all over “Christian Africa.” Would you ask the same about Asia, or Europe. Would you ask if racism would ever end in Europe, or America? Change comes with struggle, and human rights can move backwards, just look at present day America.

2

u/TTBoy44 May 27 '22

Holy crap man. Chill out.

-5

u/totallywirednyc May 27 '22

I think you need to be more secretive about it then. Stop flaunting it or pay the price of being out in a place you shouldn't be.

-5

u/s7th6 May 26 '22

I'm sorry but i don't think homophobia will ever end anywhere in the world, i live in the West and it hasnt ended here but only gotten worse recently

1

u/paulkanyamucanary May 26 '22

In East Africa it is worse 😥

3

u/s7th6 May 26 '22

i'm sure it's worse than I could ever imagine, I hope somehow you're able to get away to safety somewhere else in the world someday

3

u/paulkanyamucanary May 26 '22

I wish ..keep me in your prayers please. Im looking for support so thst I may relocate to a relatively safer area.. preferably in Nairobi.

2

u/s7th6 May 26 '22

good luck friend

1

u/nadiegirlie May 27 '22

In Tanzania nobody will try to kill you for being gay but their snarky comments about it will irritate you to death..... another man down...,..... wasted sperm and they get worse with time.

-4

u/Hanaa_M May 27 '22

Will it ever end in America?

-2

u/EntrepreneurHuman297 May 27 '22

Once you rid it of Joel Osteen

3

u/Beginning-Freedom567 May 27 '22

yeah. pretty sure you can blame anything at all that’s wrong in africa on a white guy one way or another. seems like the phony intellectual and virtue signaling answer to every thing wrong in the world

-1

u/BelieveMeURALoser May 27 '22

(insert meme) why are you gay

-1

u/RosedAnubis May 27 '22

Nope, because of the predominant Christian and Islam religions in the region

0

u/Complex-Structure216 May 27 '22

Kenya wapi though?

Pretty sure the peeps here only frown at PDA. both straight and otherwise.

You guys even have a pride parade upcoming and no one is batting an eyelid

0

u/jutnotnoTheMan May 27 '22

Freedom 🤪 , let them do what they want , people are different . The next 100 years the pedophilia will become normal as what happened with homosexuality, so principles change.

0

u/PMRANDx May 27 '22

Some'll move there soon if it doesn't hahah