r/WhitePeopleTwitter 5d ago Silver 4 Helpful 1 Wholesome 3 All-Seeing Upvote 3 Take My Energy 1

What’s with men?

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u/Aesirtrade 5d ago Silver Gold Helpful Bravo! Brighten My Day

Domestic violence is a massive co-factor in shootings like this. Something like 65% of shooters have DV histories. We could prevent a lot of shootings if we closed DV loopholes

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u/whatim 5d ago Silver

This person (the criminal shooter) actually legally changed his name (And maybe faked suicide? The story is strange) to hide from his birth father's violence.

Then used DV against the mother, threatening her life.

When you get into these stories, there is a high likelihood of DV in the histories of these "angry young men."

"He  (shooters dad) also told the reporters that he had previously praised his child for violent behaviour.

“I told him it works, it’s instant and you will get immediate results,” he said."

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u/Toby_O_Notoby 5d ago edited 5d ago

"He (shooters dad) also told the reporters that he had previously praised his child for violent behaviour.

And here's his account of learning that his son shot up a gay bar:

“There was a shooting involving multiple people, and then I go on to find out it’s a gay bar,” Brink said in an interview outside his San Diego home. “And I think, ‘oh my God, is he gay?’ I got scared, ‘Shit, is he gay?’ And he’s not gay, so I said, ‘Phhhewww…I am a Mormon, I am a conservative Republican, and we don’t do gay… My opinion about gays is that it’s not OK. I think we should stand up against homosexuality.”

EDIT: A link to the video and article. Where I think we can all agree that even if he is not OK with the gays he's very, very ok with the Meth.

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u/Plane-Reason9254 5d ago

The porn star is a conservative Mormon ? Hmmm!

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u/socialpresence 5d ago

People like this guy are a strong deterrent for hard drugs.

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u/ExtremelyOnlineChap 5d ago

He also has a long history of getting punched and kicked in the head professionally.

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u/sugiina 5d ago

"professionally" haha

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u/InformationDelivery 5d ago

Great point.

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u/IDrinkMyBreakfast 5d ago

See his cauliflower ears? This guy fights a lot. It might explain the dain bramage

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u/ExtremelyOnlineChap 5d ago

His MMA record says he’s been KO’d 11 times so I think there’s some real dain bramage at work here, on top of other things.

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u/Common-Watch4494 5d ago

This guy started off stupid/ignorant to begin with

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u/PermanentlySleeepy 5d ago

It takes hard drugs to do those mental gymnastics

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u/Zachyd1986 5d ago

I just watched an intervention episode called Aaron and Andrea, and its the shooters father (Aaron)

He injected crystal meth daily and masturbated for 10 hours at a time while watching porn the entire day.

Dont be gay, though /s

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u/BrushStorm 5d ago

Nah. It just takes religion. You can justify anything if you have religion.

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u/MyNameIsDaveToo 5d ago

Even the Spanish inquisition

Bet ya weren't expecting that

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u/Hedgehog_Totem 5d ago

The Mormon porn star meth head had a kid and he's fucking crazy .... how is this shocking?

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u/SugarDraagon 5d ago

Yea I suspect one of the heavy-hitter personality disorders, or at least a specific mood disorder that at least started the fire. Im not going to name specifics as to not stigmatize disorders that MANY many sufferers deal with successfully everyday, and have the same propensity to commit violence, or whatever ppl think-“go crazy”-as EVERY other person on Earth. In fact, they’re super fuckkng strong for carrying on as normal outwardly while REALLY dealing with difficult things that most other ppl cannot fathom. I hate the stigma, because the ones dishing it, imo, live life on easy mode and don’t have to work constantly to not feel absolutely awful, while following every societal norm and expectation despite like an anchor tied to both feet.

Idk I have, for most times in my life, been categorized as severe depressive disorder (with ADHD), and even though there have been sometimes where it moves to technically “moderate,” I pretty much feel equally just….well, I won’t go into it here bc nobody’s trying to hear that lol, but I wanna be clear that I’m not just saying “oh, he’s MENTALLY ILL👻👻👻☠️😵👿🪦 so who knows what he’s capable of because they’re unstable,” because I’m honestly more fuckkng stable than most ppl I know, but what I am saying is that I can recognize some traits that maybe made it really hard for him not to want to change his state of consciousness at all times from suffering to not suffering briefly, and then maybe things snowballed when compounded by abuse, neglect, radicalization, hard drugs, etc etc etc.

DISCLAIMER: this is assuming he’s actually sober in the video I saw lmao. If how he’s acting isn’t just how he is (I suspect it kinda is), then yea then meth all the way lol

Also, OF COURSE, I speak generally and some people and disorders don’t apply here. Again, not naming them, but I know I’m generalizing probably too much lol. I typed too much to not commit at this point lmao

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u/fingermebarney 5d ago

Orgazmo sales going through the roof as we speak.

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u/thisisredlitre 5d ago

This guy should've used a stunt cock

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u/Friendly-Biscotti-32 5d ago

Don’t wanna sound queer or nothing, but I think unicorns are kickass

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u/Only-Significance-25 5d ago hehehehe

Dad, I don't think I'm gonna do hamster style anymore.

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u/Rabbitdraws 5d ago

Apparently also a meth head. I swear this behavior must be some kind of brain damage.

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u/kynmites 5d ago

Also meth head and chronic masterbator. He's the dude from the 10-12 hours meme.

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u/an-alien- 5d ago

strong cognitive dissonance game i guess?

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u/CrazyGooseLady 5d ago

So....Dad thinks he did a good job, shooting up a gay bar. Not upset he shot a bunch of people and killed 5 of them.

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u/Primary-Bullfrog-653 5d ago

I think his first priority was to make sure his son, a mass shooter, wasn't doing the hush hush with sinful people.

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u/Pickle_Rick01 5d ago

Meanwhile, Dad’s a pornstar. “Rules for thee, not for me” or something like that.

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u/cooljerry53 5d ago

A straight porn star! God just hates gay folk donchaknow, the funny man in my TV said so!

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u/raerae1991 5d ago

I wonder if his porn star dad has the same issue with girl on girl homosexuality? I’m guessing no

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u/BrushStorm 5d ago

Well, he will spend the rest of his life in prison so he'll be hush hushing like a champ

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u/surprisedropbears 5d ago

Worse than that tbh- he thinks it’s worse to be gay than murdering a whole bunch of people.

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u/Ridiculisk1 5d ago

It's good that people are finally realising that these are the exact type of 'good Christian values' that Republicans are pushing so hard for.

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u/OrphicDionysus 5d ago

I mean, one of the most prominently members of the Mormon Quorum of the 12 (the immediate next level down in their hierarchy from the Prophet himself) did focus his largest annual address last year, which is disseminated globally and which all Mormons are supposed to watch, on "fighting back against the 'Gay Agenda'" (the church had been taking a lot of flack after a series of incidents at BYU that persecuted LGBTQ people in various ways). His thesis statement was that they "must meet it with musket fire."

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u/schu2470 5d ago

I don’t see how this isn’t labeled as hate speech and incitement of violence.

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u/GrowCrows 5d ago

More about that talk:

" His words were unmistakably a call to arms: Holland used the word “fire” 10 times, “musket” eight times, and made multiple references to “friendly fire,” “wounds,” and “scarring.” "

https://slate.com/human-interest/2021/09/mormon-lds-church-gay-rights-controversy-byu-speech.html#:~:text=His%20words%20were%20unmistakably%20a,%2C%E2%80%9D%20and%20%E2%80%9Cscarring.%E2%80%9D

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u/Pretty-Balance-Sheet 5d ago

Another thought, the church is now trying to do PR clean up by vocally supporting legislation to legalize gay marriage. Regardless, a LOT of people either went inactive or removed their name from the church records after Holland's speech.

Also worth recalling that just a few years ago the church issued an edict that essentially punished the children of gay parents by not allowing them to fully progress in the church unless they disavowed their parents.

Then there's the church's involvement in California's Prop 8. They have recent history of anti lgbtq activity. These things and Holland's speech only scratch the surface.

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u/troubadorkk 5d ago

As long as he ain't gay, by God

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u/No_Poet_7244 5d ago

If you watch the video where he says that, it’s obvious he’s a methed out tweaker. Not sure if he really “believes” anything except that he needs more meth.

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u/nonoglorificus 5d ago

My dad is a junkie. His ideas didn’t form in a meth vacuum. He was already a card carrying republican (seriously, he carried an actual card in his wallet,) long before the drugs. The drugs just intensified and scattered the shit ideas around.

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u/thatbwoyChaka 5d ago

Being a drug addict does not make you an automatic asshole; this guy has these views before he sucked a glass dick.

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u/smncalt 5d ago

am a Mormon, I am a conservative Republican, and we don’t do gay

For anyone that doesn't know, his father is a former pornographic actor. Nothing like the normal hypocrisy coming from these people.

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u/Primary-Bullfrog-653 5d ago

He was "born again" :3

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u/Cayowin 5d ago

He was baptized in meth.

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u/GranJan2 5d ago

I thought even caffeine was problematic for Mormons. Mainlining meth would seem reason for excommunication.

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u/stoutn007 5d ago

Probably, but if he hasn't been to church in years, probably no one bothered. I'd be surprised if anyone at the church knew who this guy was before this week.

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u/dogs_N_turtles 5d ago

In another thread, they had receipts that he was in “porn for gay”

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u/fangirlsqueee 5d ago

Stage name was Dick Delaware. I have not searched it, but feel free to try and find receipts.

He was also in an episode of "Intervention" on A&E.

https://play.aetv.com/shows/intervention/season-6/episode-8

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u/RatsOfTheLab 5d ago

"conservative Republican" Will the conservative Republicans stand by him?

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u/SoarLoozer 5d ago

look at you acting like gop didn't just find their lead speaker at the next CPAQ

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u/Jeanne_Poole 5d ago

So, the shooter's lawyer said at booking that his client identifies as non-binary and uses they/them pronouns. (The article I read went on to say "but he was booked in as a male and his mother calls him 'he'", as though either of those two things would mean anything one way or the other).

It's hard to know if the lawyer is using this to try to get future sympathy from a jury, or if it's true. If it's true, between the father saying that he taught his son from an early age to solve his problems with violence, and the father saying that he was more worried that the kid might be gay than that his son killed 5 people, then that man has a lot to answer for. Sounds like the man was practically trying to create a violent mass murderer.

That doesn't absolve the shooter in any way whatsoever, but it goes to show what a horrible piece of shit the father is.

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u/Tacticool_Hotdog 5d ago

They're doing that to avoid a hate crime-charge being slapped on top. Can't be a hate crime if it's against your own group, right? Nevermind the fact that there's no evidence or prior history to back their claim up.

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u/GodWantedUsToBeLit 5d ago

It absolutely can still be a hate crime if it's against your own group....at least that's how I see it. Like, gay people can still be homophobic. I know you're not saying that, specifically, and I know it's the law, but like how the fuck are we still dealing with this as a society. We shouldve moved past this shit a while ago.

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u/obiwantogooutside 5d ago

And, as a bi woman, there are certainly in-group hate divisions. There is plenty of sexism, racism, and transphobia in the queer community. Just like there is homophobia, racism, and transphobia in white feminism. There are all kinds of ways hate crimes intersect.

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u/brice587 5d ago

We, as a human race, are very good at hating.

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u/lostbutnotgone 5d ago

Lesbian/queer enby and drag king here... yeah. There's lots of misogynistic shit, racism, transphobia, etc.

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u/bolasaurus 5d ago

Honestly, some of the cis gay men I have met are the most homophobic, transphobic, racist, misogynistic people I have ever known. Sure, it's all dressed up as being 'catty' but I see right through that.

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u/LogicalContribution5 5d ago

Lindsey Graham has entered the chat

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u/GrowCrows 5d ago

I was in the military and it was pretty bad there but the most openly misogynistic men I have ever met were white cis gay men. Like I was stunned.

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u/pmcda 5d ago

The worst part is that many on the right will probably go, “see, you can’t just identify how you want” when the claim gets seen through. That’s assuming that it gets seen through, which in this day and age I wouldn’t discount smh

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u/Msdamgoode 5d ago

Yep, I agree. This is just a lawyer’s strategy to get some brownie points to help avoid hate crime charges.

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u/K9Partner 5d ago

I definitely believe that… but i can cynically see another angle too: doing that has just delighted the bigot “anti-woke” trolls everywhere, they’re spamming every post with manipulative horseshit about “OH i ThOuGHt We HaD tO ReSpEcT PrONoUnS”

…while others are deflecting blame back to “the queers” by pretending he was actually part of that community instead of their own ugly ilk… just like the bullshit rumors that Jan6 was actually ‘antifa infiltrators’, sandy hook was ‘crisis actors’ etc…, & now they’re doing the same with the fkkng hero vet that stopped the shooter- claiming its all some sort of fake false-flag operation because its incomprehensible that a “good guy with no gun” handled that shit… and was clearly not ‘one of them’ (ie not a righty hateful bigot), as they’re desperate to be the hero or victim in every situation.

Anyways… it may indeed be a lawyer gambit against the hate crime charges… but Its also given the bad guys juuust the right (stupid fraud) angles they desperately need to dismiss this all. This kid is messed up, obviously raised with fck knows how much abuse. These awful people around him since birth totally manipulated & crushed his development… and i wouldn’t put it past them to further manipulate him now, to frame things to their benefit, like convincing him to claim NB & drag the community as one last “[email protected] u to the libs”.

I can also see a situation where he was indeed some form of queer, always, and the self-hating horrors of growing up gay or enby or whatever around that kind of hostility IS what drove him to this point… awful, believable… but i dont believe, after all that abuse (& cultish programming & bigot brainwashing, to the point of driving to kill all the gays) that someone would just do a full 180 in 24hours & suddenly be fully out & embrace that identity…

After years of therapy in jail ya ok, but overnight? please. I think its a layered gambit- the lawyers hail-mary at undermining the charges, with the added ‘bonus’ of screwing with the community they harmed, trying to gaslight them into accepting blame 💩

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u/tacocat_racecarlevel 5d ago

I just.. I can't. How is this real?!

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u/deadgardenia 5d ago

Said the former p0rn star. FFS.

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u/sailorjupiter28titan 5d ago

Hey there, his sex work does not define him. He is also a Mormon and meth addict.

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u/agrandthing 5d ago

That man is one hot mess. Or one hot meth I should say.

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u/rascible 5d ago

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u/Juicepit 5d ago

Holy shnikes I remember that show… so his dad never stopped banging meth and beating off all day? Then raised a dumb psychopath loser murderer?

The shit apple doesn’t fall far from the shit tree

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u/rascible 5d ago

Not to pile on, but here's 20 minutes of him methmumbling

https://youtu.be/0f6TXdNXcWk

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u/pnwbraids 5d ago

I got about halfway through and had to stop. This man is clearly brain damaged, yeah, but he also seems to just be at his core an aggressive person who sees violence as foundational to his identity.

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u/ArthurMorgansHorse 5d ago

God damn that man has lost his mind.

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u/physithespian 5d ago Gold

Yo that was absolutely heartbreaking. The man clearly isn’t with it anymore. The family life sounds awful. And here’s still a guy devastated by what has happened. “Human life is fragile. Human life is valuable.” Not a redemption arc. It’s just really fucking sad.

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u/gillababe 5d ago

You hear that? It's the winds of shit, rand

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u/spaceguitar 5d ago

Nah it’s fine! He’s Mormon—paragon of virtue, all that nonsense.

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u/RogueSlytherin 5d ago

I hate that I even have to ask this, but which one? There have been at least three shootings this week with one being in my state. I don’t remember hearing any of this with respect to the local shooting, and it’s sad that there are so many, I can’t keep them straight anymore.

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u/whatim 5d ago

In this context, I meant the Colorado Springs tragedy.

But you are right - so much violence, so hard to believe.

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u/RogueSlytherin 5d ago

Now I’m even more ashamed. Unfortunately, that was the local case I was talking about. I can’t believe I missed all of this, but I’ve also been trying to focus primarily on the victims and the people who jumped in to stop him (especially that Drag Queen).

I hate that this has become such a frequent occurrence. At some point they all start to bleed together, just an endless sea of violence and mass casualties. It’s even more distressing in a state with a red flag law; this could’ve been prevented.

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u/WhismurGang 5d ago

Just wanted to say that one of the individuals who stepped in to stop him is a trans woman, not a drag queen. You're absolutely right though. Two of the shootings this week have been in my home state. It's scary not feeling safe in any public space, especially as a trans person myself.

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u/vampirepriestpoison 5d ago

Trans woman and an army vet. No drag queens required.

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u/wannabejoanie 5d ago

It's funny, I live close by. All the focus is on the straight veteran dad who went into combat mode, nobody is even mentioning the name of the trans woman who helped stop that fucker with her heels.

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u/beans1231231234 5d ago

people started dead naming her just to be mean

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u/EremiticFerret 5d ago

There were interviews with his horrible, horrible father that just came out today. Bits were on the front page 6ish hours ago. Here is one:

https://www.reddit.com/r/WhitePeopleTwitter/comments/z2z2ui/wtf/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

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u/[deleted] 5d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/cap1112 5d ago

I see what you’re saying, but if my child was killed, I wouldn’t want that image of them all over the internet for the creeps who get off on that stuff. She deserves better than that. Just thinking of that makes me sick.

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u/Regi413 5d ago

Between this and “Oh shit I’m so relieved my son isn’t gay even though he literally murdered people” it’s clear that the shit apple doesn’t fall far from the shit tree.

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u/AceDelta12 5d ago

THE FUCK?! Why would he praise this behavior?!

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u/verasev 5d ago

He's evil? Lots of people are and now they're being encouraged to make it public.

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u/metalmorian 5d ago

Yes, that is the other thing they have in common.

DV against women

Absent/abusive fathers

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u/StandardSudden1283 5d ago

It's mostly these Republicans who are being bottlefed hateful ideologies, like that gay people are groomers, they're being told they have to "save the children".

It's called stochastic terrorism and the right is using it to terrorize all of us.

This is what the rise of fascism looks like in this respect. Hold onto your seats ladies and gentlemen, if history is any measure we're in for a fucked up, wild ride.

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u/JesusKong333 5d ago

The Republicans are really the groomers in this situation. Preying on mentally unstable or just gullible kids. Dylan Roof, Kyle Rittenhouse, the Michigan shooter, all groomed by the far-right

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u/Smoaktreess 5d ago

The Oxford shooter’s parents are at least being charged in Michigan although the school also messed up.

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u/lostbutnotgone 5d ago

As a queer AFAB person, right here and right now? I am fucking terrified.

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u/Yuural 5d ago

Here in germany we start to look at america the same way that america looked at us in 1933... at least you have a counter force that is about equally as big as your special religious ultra right fascists so no adolf trump can just seize power with a majority of the new american reich backing him. For a tech producing land with a cowardly leadership like us this will be very profitable tho.

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u/Youareobscure 5d ago

Here in the US, many of us are also looking at our country like Germany in the 30's

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u/Pluto_Rising 5d ago

The father should be in jail without bail as well. If that's not abusive enabling, idk what.

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u/yolistenupman 5d ago

Papa doesn’t look like he’s a stranger to jail.

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u/InuitOverIt 5d ago

My wife's ex husband who was ramping up from tearing up her clothes to smashing her things to spraying her in the face with cleaner while she was sleeping to punching the wall next to her head in an argument... then chased her our of the house with a gun when she finally left him. She called the cops and they took his guns for 3 days while he was under observation. Now he's all good though, can own whatever guns he wants.

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u/throwawayoctopii 5d ago

Yeah, my state has a loophole that if you get convicted of DV after you have your guns, you can keep them. You just can't purchase new guns.

A former Marine with multiple DV convictions was holding his wife and infant daughter hostage at gunpoint. He went downstairs to get more guns and she called the cops from her Apple Watch. Within 20 seconds of the cops arriving, the guy ambushed the officers, killing a new recruit.

I really thought that would push a rule change, but people actually had the audacity to blame the wife for calling the cops and not letting them know her husband had PTSD.

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u/Night_Duck 5d ago

Cops tend to sympathize with domestic abusers...

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u/Plenty_Ocelot_6302 5d ago

"It's a he said she said"

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u/sunveren 5d ago

Literally had this said to me when I called the police after my abusive ex husband verbally threatened to kill me and had a where, when, and how.

At least it's all documented so everyone can drag both him and our fine local law enforcement when I'm dead.

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u/TechnoSwamp 5d ago

My friend had this said to her over fucking rape, wasn't allowed to push charges

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u/samurairaccoon 5d ago

Lol classic. Cop kills unarmed black man running away: Nothing we can do, his fault for running. Cop gets shot by armed assailant: Poor guy! Why did you involve us in this?!

ACAB

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u/Goose_Spy 5d ago

Something like 65% of shooters have DV histories. We could prevent a lot of shootings if we closed DV loopholes

Why would the cops go after their own?

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u/Necessary-Dark-4591 5d ago

Police unions will never allow that.

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u/Aesirtrade 5d ago

Yeah. Probably 20% of the US police force would be unable to carry a firearm. Works for me. I dont need a guy who deals with stress by punching his wife out of street with qualified immunity and a firearm. Dude can go work in construction and make a decent living

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u/Zim_Pi 5d ago

“The most recent research in police domestic violence has shown that officers may perpetrate domestic violence at a higher rate than the general population, 28% versus 16%, respectively.”

Source

Edit: quotations

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u/0hMyGodWhy 5d ago

Even 16% is insanely high.. wtf

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u/Starlos 5d ago

And I'm fairly certain that it's a very conservative number too. It's probably even higher than that.

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u/Sword-of-Azrael 5d ago

Only 65%?

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u/coreythebuckeye 5d ago

If you’re a donestic a user it’s like there’s two genders; mass shooter or cop

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u/Helpfulcloning 5d ago

A lot of mass shootings also start with the assault of a female family memeber.

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u/BlackPitOfDespair 5d ago

Let’s talk about the people who poison the minds of impressionable young men and use them for thier self aggrandizement and commercial gain. They too must be held accountable. We should also identify and intervene with young men who are at risk. Without a supply of list young men the people who prey on them will be crippled

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u/incredibly_bad 5d ago

Let's talk about people who shouldn't have guns.

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u/CasualtyofBore 5d ago

I agree so much. Violence is being sold to our kids right on their phones. These people are pure evil and don't care who dies for a quick buck.

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u/SpacerCat 5d ago

And to adults on several ‘news’ channels.

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u/mindfulformiles 5d ago Helpful All-Seeing Upvote Got the W

Politicians and conspiracists are Gaslighting. Gaslighting is abuse. Abuse causes or compounds trauma. People with unresolved trauma from abuse are far more likely to act abusive. This is mass abuse, mass trauma, mass crisis. This is not just politics, this is a public health crisis.

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u/GETitOFFmeNOW 5d ago edited 4d ago

This is the level truth. There is imposed, projected trauma maintained through outright lying, yes, and abusive gaslighting. Families are being torn apart. A wonderful friend is waiting on word about her MAGA mother who is the ICU demanding hydrochloroquine and (edit:) ivermectin. She refused remdesevir for 3 days. She acquiesced but it may be too late. And it's well-established that more Republicans than democrats die of covid to the point it may effect the outcome of elections.

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u/Menkau-re 5d ago

Yeah, the gerrymandering had been conducted BEFORE all the COVID deaths.

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u/JoeSanPatricio 5d ago

Honestly I just don’t feel bad for them at all. Their family and others who they’ve potentially exposed, absolutely. But the individuals that worked extra hard to concoct ridiculous conspiracy theories that fly in the face of the evidence only to be proven so thoroughly wrong in such a poetic way? I got nothin. I’m glad they won’t be spreading their dumb ass harmful ideas anymore 🤷

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u/LightboxRadMD 5d ago

I just don't get how playing make believe is worth risking your life with these people. I understand it gets to the point where you become a "true believer" but my experience with these types it begins like a casual sports team mentality - "My friends and family are Team Masks R Fer Thuh Libz. Let's all get together and cheer for this seemingly arbitrary thing and laugh about how the other team sucks!" You would think once you're in the ICU with a tube down you throat you might entertain a little bit of reality, but I guess not....

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u/Goose_Spy 5d ago

They also heavily demonise mental illness, for example associate lgbt with mental illness when they demonise lgbt...which is kind of ironic to me because their voters need mental help the most.

And due to the toxic masculinity they also perpetuate, getting help for mental illness is for pussies, man up bro.... ("bring back manly men")

Also, we should look into how video games cause violence (shifting blame)

It's the perfect situation for those politicians. Cause/make worse the mental illness with their conspiracies, disinformation using heavily emotionally loaded language and fear propaganda(very effective), and with their outdated gender roles "man strong, man no weak" manipulate your victims to not seek help, and then stochastic terrorism them into action then deny involvement or blame it on the opposite political party, or blame it on the mental illness (that your rhetoric caused or made worse) but do nothing to adress it.

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u/cypher302 5d ago Helpful Heartwarming

Need to promote men's mental health a lot more and make speaking about emotions more accepted

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u/Pandepon 5d ago edited 5d ago To The Stars

Women typically focus inward when dealing with mental health challenges while men typically focus on an external fix for their challenges. Men will choose substance abuse, alcoholism, workaholism, and seek more sexual partners to cope with their mental health.

What do we teach men as a society?

WORKING A LOT = MASCULINE, GOOD

HIGH ALCOHOL TOLERANCE = MASCULINE, GOOD

FUCKING LOTS OF WOMEN = MASCULINE, GOOD

I think society needs to re-think how they are raising the next generations of men.

Mental health treatment needs to be something provided by schools to prevent the next generation of mass shooters. I’m certain there would be fewer mass shootings if kids had access to mental health treatment to cope with traumas they experience as children.

From Jillian Peterson: Early childhood trauma seems to be the foundation for mass shooters, whether violence in the home, sexual assault, parental suicides, extreme bullying. Then you see the build toward hopelessness, despair, isolation, self-loathing, oftentimes rejection from peers. That turns into a really identifiable crisis point where they’re acting differently. Sometimes they have previous suicide attempts.

What’s different from traditional suicide is that the self-hate turns against a group. They start asking themselves, “Whose fault is this?” Is it a racial group or women or a religious group, or is it my classmates? The hate turns outward. There’s also this quest for fame and notoriety. I don’t think most people realize that mass shootings are suicides, in addition to homicides. Mass shooters design these to be their final acts. When you realize this, it completely flips the idea that someone with a gun on the scene is going to deter this. If anything, that’s an incentive for these individuals. They are going in to be killed. It’s hard to focus on the suicide because these are horrific homicides.

If we explain this problem as pure evil or other labels like terrorist attack or hate crime, we feel better because it makes it seem like we’ve found the motive and solved the puzzle. But we haven’t solved anything. We’ve just explained the problem away.

We need to build teams to investigate when kids are in crisis and then link those kids to mental health services. The problem is that in a lot of places, those services are not there. There’s no community mental health and no school-based mental health. Schools are the ideal setting because it doesn’t require a parent to take you there. A lot of perpetrators are from families where the parents are not particularly proactive about mental health appointments.

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u/Propenso 5d ago

Won't happen in the short run.

Truth is, society in general likes the idea of a men opening and speaking about emotions in theory, but in practice it's a minefield.

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u/Majestic_Magi 5d ago

Truth. People love to tell men they need to open up until they start to open up. When they finally do they’re “babies” and “extra” “not a man” and any other number of insults designed to shut their emotions back in. I know too many men who’ve had this experience

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u/Bestness 5d ago

“Talk about your emotions” … “NO, NOT LIKE THAT!”

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u/citrausa 5d ago

Exactly. Once I opened up about my military service, I truly believe my gfs feelings about me changed

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u/Commercial-Shame-335 5d ago Gold

notice how they're almost all conservative men with families that support their actions (to an extent) and unsurprisingly don't believe in mental health issues

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u/pastel_boho_love 5d ago edited 5d ago

My mind is BLOWN when I hear someone use that phrase.

Can you imagine hearing the following conversation?

"Yeah, I have a severe chronic heart condition, so I need to see the doctor often."

"That's stupid. Sorry, but I don't believe in cardiovascular health. It's just people being too weak/ it's just people trying to get attention. They're just not trying hard enough."

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u/emolr 5d ago

The sad thing is there really are some people who believe something like that about a lot of medical conditions (COVID, food allergies, etc)

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u/Rodrigii_Defined 5d ago

Yeah, they believe Jesus heals all. 🙄

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u/xSARGEx117x 5d ago

This was a friend's parents, unironically.

Doctors told them he needs to stop consuming gluten and dairy, so of course they just prayed on it and decided he needed MORE. Because God told them that's how to heal him.

Once he got to 16, he found out his own medical problems, stopped eating all that shit, immediately started feeling great, and before he hit 20 he had jumped almost a foot in height and packed on a ton of muscle.

He now has to bring his own food to family gatherings because the rest of his family (except his coeliac sister) will lie to his face and say it's all gluten free, and the first ingredient is whole grain wheat, or lactose free and it's a milk based sauce or something. First trip to the hospital taught him not to trust them.

But they assure him they've been praying for healing and it's what God wants.

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u/redmark77 5d ago

Come on, pull your heart up by your boot straps. Back in my day we just pushed through it, well then we died of a heart attack, but I'm still alive.

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u/pastel_boho_love 5d ago

When I was your age, my dad beat me with a belt so hard I cried when I sat, and I had to walk 2 miles school every day in ten foot snow. I turned out fine, even though I traumatized my children by not acknowledging and managing my own trauma. You all have everything so easy, you're spoiled.

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u/Ell15 5d ago

The same people will remark about how all the people they grew up with are dead already smh woe is them

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u/Perversaurus 5d ago edited 5d ago

There are people who genuinley believe that...it's absolutely idiotic

Look at COVID, a solid chunk of conservatives don't believe it's even real

I had it and almost died in December 2021 and my uncle had two things to say about it: "It was just a flu, and if vaccines work why did you get it". My grandmother agreed

No inquiry about my health or recovery, just spreading false information and punishing people who are a living testament to their lies

I was just supposed to be fine since "COVID isn't real", so how dare I be hospitalized

Ironically my grandmother was hospitalized with COVID just last month. And she was there for two weeks. Instead of being thankful that they saved her life, she just spread lies that they "fed her the vaccine" in her food

Completely asinine...

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u/threevus 5d ago

I too almost died from it in 2020, and still have lasting problems from it in 2022…. The amount of times I’ve had to keep my mouth shut and walk away…. It’s astounding. I can no longer have sympathy for anyone who ignores the warning signs and the solution.

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u/Guinnessmonkey2 5d ago

I lost my temper enough that I got permabanned from Twitter. Apparently calling someone a "fucking psycho" and then blocking them is "harassment" and "bullying". It doesn't matter that they're encouraging people to put my health at risk (I'm immunosuppressed due to a transplant).

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u/DollyDinkle 5d ago

I hope your long Covid problems go away soon!

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u/wasabicheesecake 5d ago

I’ve seen denial of mental health issues in families from people who seemingly have the same issue, but they consider the untreated issue and it’s effects on people around them as “just who I am.” They can’t recognize it’s a problem in someone close to them and continue their denial about themself.

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u/GreenSockNinja 5d ago Gold

https://www.statista.com/statistics/476456/mass-shootings-in-the-us-by-shooter-s-race/

Interestingly enough only 53% of mass shootings are committed by white people, which is actually under representation because as of 2021 the us is 57.8% white. However, it is overwhelmingly male.

I don’t feel like poisoning the well by saying “it’s all white conservative men” is helpful to the situation in any way shape or form and distracts from the real problem of broken men, and points it at political standpoints. Everybody knows news stations do things based on clicks, and they only really show the white shooters on TV, which again is part of the problem by glamorizing these “people,” and they get more clicks if it’s a white guy cuz they can spin it. It’s not even a conspiracy, it’s just exactly what they do, it’s obvious and it’s counterproductive to solving the problem of mass shootings.

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u/davidsandbrand 5d ago Take My Energy

Almost entirely conservative men.

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u/JaxBigSexy 5d ago

Batshit Crazy.

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u/zuzg 5d ago

That's implied with them being conservative

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u/CupMain4167 5d ago Heartwarming

Conservative white men.

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u/The_Polite_Debater 5d ago Silver Wholesome Starry

https://www.statista.com/statistics/476456/mass-shootings-in-the-us-by-shooter-s-race/

Broadly speaking mass shootings seem to roughly correlate to racial diversity in the USA. White shooters account for 53 percent of all mass shootings as of 2021. The exception is Latinos who seem to be underrepresented when the stats go by racial diversity.

It is predominantly male however.

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u/KrazyTom 5d ago

I know it'll be drowned out by the other comments but it also correlates really well with Domestic violence. 2/3 is insane

Violence begets violence.

https://efsgv.org/press/study-two-thirds-of-mass-shootings-linked-to-domestic-violence/

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u/SexualPie 5d ago

thats interesting. the vast majority of domestic violence goes unreported though, i wonder how that would change the verdict here

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u/Pale_Imagination7202 5d ago

Domestic violence is the common name for narcissistic abuse. It’s not just they’re violent, they have a personality disorder- ie narcissism or psychopathy.

Source: victim of DV

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u/NoxTempus 5d ago

Huh, quick google of US racial demographics shows white to be 57.8% of the population.

So these 2 numbers in a vacuum show white to be underrepresented, for 2021, at least.

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u/H1ld3gunst 5d ago

No, that is just perception.
White man: Mass shooter Brown man: Terrorist Black man: Gangster

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u/SnooAvocados763 5d ago

Conservative white christian men.

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u/SebiGamez 5d ago

A child who is not embraced by the village will burn it down to feel its warmth.

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u/Pandepon 5d ago

We need mental healthcare to be available in schools.

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u/slopcrusher 4d ago

Absolutely. They have school nurses, but the “councillors” are COMPLETE garbage. Kids are at a very very sensitive time in school. How they’re treated by other students can either set them up for success or low self worth.

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u/JKFrost14011991 4d ago

Good saying. About to split hairs, so feel free to skip this one. Just... angry.

A lot of kids don't get embraced by the village. Queer kids, for example. And yet, despite that, they don't burn anything down. They try to survive. They get on with their lives. They build their own villages.

And then shitheads like this come snd burn them down. Or worse, they warp their own children to do it for them.

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u/chunkalicious84 5d ago edited 5d ago Wholesome

A lot of it is how many males still do not believe in talking about mental health.

Edit: It is interesting how one sentence has sparked so many replies.

It is also interesting to see how many of you made so many assumptions about me based off of this.

For the record, I am a 38 year old white male living in Ohio. I am on my second marriage. I grew up in a very conservative Christian household.

I have been on anti-anxiety and depression pills for 14 years and tried killing myself 17 years ago. 5 years ago, i went through a school shooting where I saw two teens get killed. I barely got my door shut before he could get into my classroom and kill my students.

I have PTSD and went to weekly therapy for two years afterwards and still seek therapy.

At the end of the day, if we all had more empathy for each other and quit judging others, we could avoid so much violence.

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u/ZAPANIMA 5d ago

Knew a guy who genuinely believed that pills and therapy for mental health were strictly for "women and pussies". Often told me how much of a man he was for never going to therapy for his childhood trauma and how he has no mental disorders that needed pills.

He was easily the most fucked up person mentally I've ever been forced to interact with. (co-worker)

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u/Many_Adhesiveness_43 5d ago

Knew a guy who genuinely believed that pills and therapy for mental health were strictly for "women and pussies".

This infuriates me so much. Had an argument with an ex-friend a bit back because he was making fun of a dude for crying and calling him a little bitch. The fucking hypocrisy. He would complain all the time about women hurting, abusing, and stealing from men but the second a man cries about being cheated on he's apparently a wuss and deserves it. I will never get that shit mentality.

How the hell can you honestly complain about men's problems but then sit there and make fun of another man showing emotion during a time that is very fucking hard to go through and process.

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u/VGSchadenfreude 5d ago

Bet he then blames women (and feminism) for men being mocked for expressing emotions other than rage, too. With not a single hint of irony or self-awareness.

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u/Jaigg 5d ago

See that's stupid. Vegetables are for women and children. Pills are for everyone.

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u/_Terrible_Advice_ 5d ago

Omg you just reminded me when I was at a hibachi restaurant and some guy proudly announced he doesn't eat vegetables when the chef was about to put some on his plate. Like not eating vegetables makes you manly. No, it makes you a toddler who requires helicopter noises to be fed.

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u/81jmfk 5d ago

Pills are gooooood

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u/Turbulent-Ad8291 5d ago

fat gurgling death sounds

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u/-everythingbagel 5d ago

The fact that I literally just emulated this sound out loud.

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u/ParlorSoldier 5d ago

The fact that “pills are good” is automatically said in Jim Carrey’s voice in my head.

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u/TerpfanTi 5d ago

No self awareness

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u/anonoman925 5d ago

Boys aren’t encouraged to talk about their mental health.

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u/[deleted] 5d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/summonsays 5d ago

One of my earliest memories was a birthday party and I was crying. I don't remember why, just that I was taken out of the room and my mom or grandma (don't even remember which) said "Stop crying, you're a boy. Boys don't cry." I was probably 3 or 4. It's taken a long time to unlearn some things.

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u/CptMuffinator 5d ago

Worse. On top of being mocked, we are dismissed when we try to bring up the toxic masculinity behind it.

You call someone out for saying man up and you're the odd one.

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u/Mattie_Doo 5d ago

A lot of us just have a hard time finding people who want or care to listen. If you go by Reddit you’d think the world is full of people to talk to. Truthfully, most people don’t want to hear it.

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u/MountainSage58 5d ago

Men have never been particularly good at sharing their feelings, or encouraging other men to share their feelings. Conservative men are uniquely, horribly angry. I mean I'm not a psychologist, but I am a man, and it's a pretty easy call to make.

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u/human_number1312 5d ago

For a long time, men have also been told by society that it's not appropriate to share their feelings. They're expected to bottle them up and soldier on no matter what. That whole narrative needs to change.

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u/MountainSage58 5d ago

Believe me, I agree. It's ruining us.

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u/Prestigious-Gap-1163 5d ago

What I see in this thread is a lot of people that recognize a problem. But no one discussing a solution. Everyone is saying the same thing and no one is talking to each other. How do we change this for the next generations if we just bitch about how bad we had it and don’t step up and make it better together!

We did it with Vets coming home and needing support after decades of failures. Let’s stop waiting for the government to make some program and just use social media to have men supporting men and raising young men to understand emotional strength.

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u/Thebadmamajama 5d ago

A genuine problem is funding for studying the problem has been chronically avoided or blocked. https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/decades-long-gap-gun-violence-research-funding-lasting/story?id=80646946

So there's some issue that we don't fully understand the root problem. And when solutions are proposed there's a lack of consensus on effectiveness.

Some have proposed a layers of swiss cheese approach to policies, recognizing that no one set of laws and programs is without gaps. So many would start having an effect somehow...

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u/UndeadBBQ 5d ago Gold Faith In Humanity Restored Starry

You let them into a world where they're constantly told they need money, women and success to be worth anything, while taking away the pressure valves, while discouraging mental health, while telling them they're weak for showing emotions,...

Then these men grow up when money is hard to come by, success a poker game and women independent enough to not need them, and their entire purpose on this world is gone.

The right-wing influencer sphere preys on these men, gives them "purpose", and one in a hundred actually grabs a rifle and goes to do "his part".

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u/cheekiewalrus 5d ago

This is probably the best summation of the problem that I’ve seen thus far.

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u/joeyo1423 5d ago

Men exist in other countries too. Even countries with gun ownership. Why not there?

Sure - the men argument is a good one, but it's so much more than that. It's our shitty culture. Mass shooters are idolized by a small fraction of men. I don't know why. But I do know that you can't kill an idea. Mass murders are not going anywhere so long as they glorified in the eyes of the apathetic

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u/RockleyBob 5d ago

Something else that goes unsaid is that, often, these shooters are suicidal. Conceivably, their plans unfold from an initial desire to kill themselves, and from there they begin to think about how to make their exit memorable. Any meaningful attempt at a solution must also address suicidal feelings and their prevention.

A different set of researchers who analyzed 41 school shooters for the Secret Service and Department of Education found that 78 percent had a history of thinking about or attempting suicide.

Suicide Prevention Could Prevent Mass Shootings - fivethirtyeight.com

It's understandable that in the wake of tragedy we don't want to spend time empathizing with the shooters, but if we never do the uncomfortable work of asking why these people a.) want to kill themselves and b.) what attracts them to taking others out with them, then how can we hope to stop it?

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u/Party_Lab_69 5d ago

Looking at this guys dad, there's no need to wonder why he felt this way. It's horrible what he did, but not unsurprising seeing the bs his dad as said

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u/Piogre 5d ago edited 5d ago Silver Gold Wholesome

Plenty of countries have lax gun laws. Plenty of countries have guns. America's gun culture is out of control.

The term "toxic masculinity" gets frowned on a lot by people who think it's a feminist term calling men toxic. However, it's important to understand that "toxic masculinity" was coined by a men's movement called the Mythopoetics who identified a culture that promoted only the most harmful aspects of masculinity and devalued the rest. In particular, men are pressured to act violently, suppress emotions, and avoid reliance on others.

The gun culture in the US is a textbook example of this communal pressure, at an extreme. Guns are tools; they serve a specific function. To any sane person, a tool is only as functional as the person holding it; nothing more. However within the culture, they serve as a fashion statement, a political statement, and a symbol of masculinity all in one. In the culture, the gun makes the man. So when a man within the culture feels powerless, feels emasculated, he picks up his symbol of masculinity to fix that.

Any thinking American who values the second amendment should be motivated to change the culture around guns, because as long as that culture is around, this sort of thing is going to keep happening until there's enough political will to kill the second amendment for good.

edit:typ0

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u/medusa_crowley 5d ago

I'd award this comment if I could. Thank you for typing it out because I've been saying the same for a long long time.

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u/its_me_phosphene 5d ago

On a worldwide scale men commit 95% of all murders. Not mass shootings, you’re right, but male violence is obviously an international problem.

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u/DaimondGuy 5d ago

Solution: create a fund to promote women shooters

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u/TFarrey 5d ago

already happening ... women are the fastest growing demographic of new gun owners

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u/idiot_trader_69 5d ago

If we're ignoring small percentages, it's also a uniquely American issue. What's with Americans?

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u/theedgeofoblivious 5d ago

Male violence isn't the elephant in the room for mass shootings.

It's the elephant in the room for violence in general.

The elephant in the room for mass shootings is inequality caused by the people at the top. I'm not saying that everything needs to be equal among everyone, but what I'm saying is that violence happens when you have people who are isolated and feeling desperate. If you want to decrease feelings of desperation and isolation you need to work to reduce inequality. Target racism and discrimination based on income, and prevent wealth from accumulating to the degree it does at the top while people near the bottom feel victimized and hopeless. That spreads, and negative feelings in communities lead to violence.

People who are thriving do not cause mass shootings.

Communities which are thriving do not experience mass shootings.

Societies which are thriving do not experience mass shootings.

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u/Starfish_Hero 5d ago

Every country has men. Every country has mental health issues. Many countries have a dejected young populace. One country has mass shootings. No need to overthink this guys.

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u/Sudden_Lawfulness118 5d ago

I've seen multiple groups for mental health focused on women and minorities. What I've seen for white men is to be told to, "Take it like a man" or "Real men don't cry." This guy was beat as a child. We have CPS, but that is a highly underfunded and understaffed organization. We focus so little on protecting children or taking care of the mental health of men that none of us should be surprised with this happens. These shootings are not going to stop. They are only going to get worse because we as a society refuse to address these issues.

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u/MushyPrawns 4d ago

What a piss poor take.

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u/Empigee 5d ago

Actually, the elephant in the room is radical right-wing terrorism.

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u/Whydoesthisexist15 5d ago

Right-wing terrorism plays on insecurities of men and their masculinity writ large.

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u/DurunirYT 5d ago

Men also kill themselves more than women. This is a mental health, and lack of emotional support issue.

And before you get pissy about it, men's attitudes towards getting mental Healthcare also sucks.

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u/Shiraxi 5d ago

It's so much in how men and boys are raised, and taught to close off our emotions. That the only acceptable emotion to display is anger. That sadness is a woman's emotion, and we shouldn't cry, we shouldn't talk about it, we should close it off and forget about it.

This makes it extremely difficult for many men to properly display and acknowledge their real emotions, and even more difficult for them to talk about things like mental health and depression.

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