Now we debate the ethicality and morality of suicide, whether or not “my body my choice” includes the choice to make a blood-and-meat puddle on the sidewalk, and euthanasia and how accessible it should be.
The choice to die like this? No, but it isn't like there were much other choices for him to choose. Meds? Die in agony. Hanging? Slightly less agony. Gunshot? Need a gun.
He should've had the choice to die peacefully, cleanly with the lowest amount of pain possible
lol i was going to source this and google keeps killing my search with help hotline results. Fuck me i don't know why that was so funny. Any way, i seem to remember hearing it can be.
No really, what you don't want is for your liver to start dying. If you take sleeping pills but wake up because your liver starts to fail, you're in for a wild and painful final moment on earth.
whether or not “my body my choice” includes the choice to make a blood-and-meat puddle on the sidewalk
A person undergoing a psychotic episode cannot necessarily provide informed consent.
I'm not suggesting everyone who tries to die is undergoing a psychotic episode, but it's important to understand that there's a big difference between "feeling suicidal," "not wanting to live/exist," and "feeling compelled to go through with jumping off a building in order to complete an act of suicide," with lots of degrees in between that may change from second to second, minute to minute, or month to month. This is what's meant by the phrase "a permanent solution to a temporary problem."
There are also instances where someone is jumping at the prompting of- or to stop the prompting of- hallucinations, or perhaps because they're having a bad reaction to an anti-depressant, anti-psychotic, or other medication. There is the consideration over whether any of those reasons, or even seeking to eliminate existential suffering resembles anything that a reasonable person would consider being a genuine choice...And all that is a different animal from suicide attempts by people with certain personality disorders, who threaten others with as an act of desperate manipulation.
Edit: There was some confusion expressed, so I would like to clarify that I am not talking about end-of-life decisions made by people who have terminal, untreatable illnesses. These are niche scenarios that don't constitute any significant portion of reasons given for attempting suicide.
I am specifically referring to people who attempt suicide in the course of mental illness, who are experiencing a mental breakdown/psychotic episode, or otherwise experiencing intense psychological distress to the degree that you can't seriously suggest that their decision to kill themselves is rational or well-informed. These cases are the vast majority of suicides, as much as 90%.
This is what's meant by the phrase "a permanent solution to a temporary problem."
But that ignorant phrase totally discounts the fact that for many people, their circumstances aren't constantly changing. Their situation often isn't "temporary", unless you consider years or even decades of depression to be "temporary".
I can agree to that, for 80% of my life I've been sure I want to die.
Someone can tell me it will get better, but what exactly will get better? I know for a fact its only going downhill from here, my parents will die, my friends will form families, I will never be able to get enough money for a comfortable living so I will struggle forever.
Sure something MAY happen to change all that and actually give me a reason to be enthusiastic about living, but what are the odds? Give me a clean and sure way to go and i'm out the door yesterday, seriously, its hard to get a gun where I live, I envy americans a lot.
And by the way, if i finally summoned the courage to jump off a roof and some "hero" snatched away my peace I don't even know how i would react.
My religion considers suicide to be a selfish move, which is kind of true in most situations. You’re not killing yourself for someone else. Of course, I’m fine with that if you have a terminal illness with no hope of recovery. I’m not fine with hormonal teenagers having access to euthanasia. I’m not sure what to think of military veterans or very burnt out South Koreans. In the end, someone’s values, hopefully similar to one of our’s, will be enforced upon others for better or for worse.
Really, anything can be attested to a religion or a cult. Most religions these days forbid murder, although some cults and sects out there are suicidal or sacrifices humans. Making murder doesn’t make a country theocratic, neither is preventing minors from killing themselves. Besides, the original comment you were replying to didn’t mention religion at all.
That would be nice, but I don't have any reason to believe that would be the case in practicality, given the current state of affairs in mental healthcare- at least in the United States.
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u/c0uchpizza Aug 13 '21
What if they didn’t want to live?