Sea Shepherds have great ideals and do good things but they're so fucking dumb and they're a bunch of fucking assholes.
I lived in Hobart, where they would make port and they'd cause so much trouble in town, bullying ppl, getting in fights etc. They think they're badass but they're idiots.
Sacrificing their million dollar stealth speedboat the My Ady Gil by parking it in the way of a whaling ship and hoping to take them to court for damages, they forgot the first rule of maritime law; the least maneuverable ship has the right of way. They lost that case.
They tried stopping a legal seal cull in Canada and got their boat, the MV Farley Mowat impounded. They never claimed it back and now face a law suit for abandoning a derelict vessel that's leaking oil everywhere.
They took a video trying to show a Japanese whaling ship ramming them, yet it's clear that the SS ship, The Steve Irwin, is the ones changing course to purposely collide with the whaling ship.
They board other ships in international waters (piracy) and whine and cry when they get detained in a brig and brought back to face a court.
They have wasted soooo much money donated to them by benefactors.
Seriously, it's as though they're all kids playing with boats in a bathtub. Idiots.
Pretty much. Even this pic is doctored to fit their agenda. 80% of plastics in the ocean are from land, yet they stood on a pile of fishing net and made a claim that fits their goals.
46% of the plastic is from fishing nets. Other types of fishing gear account for a substantial portion of the remainder:
A comprehensive new study by Slat’s team of scientists, published in Scientific Reports Thursday, concluded that the 79,000 tons was four to 16 times larger than has been previously estimated for the patch. The study also found that fishing nets account for 46 percent of the trash, with the majority of the rest composed of other fishing industry gear, including ropes, oyster spacers, eel traps, crates, and baskets.
The pacific rubbish patch represents a very small amount of the plastic in the worlds oceans. Most of the plastic is in the form of microplastics and non-buoyant plastics. Greenpeace did a study in 2019 that placed discarded fishing gear (not just nets) at 10% of the errant plastic in the ocean. I will grant you that the pacific rubbish patch is largely discarded fishing gear but it is much less of a problem compared to other forms of plastic.
I think it gets a lot of attention because it is the area of most obvious danger to large marine life (despite the fact that microplastics in the food chain are just as dangerous to whales/dolphins etc.) and it also provides people with a scapegoat (i.e. fishermen & women) that makes them feel better about themselves so they can pretend that they aren't just as big of a contributor the global problem.
I watched that documentary on Netflix, I think it was (forgot the name) and I thought the same thing. All that "info" is only good for people to say "welp, that makes me blameless!". And I even had a moment after where I was like "fuck fisherman" but then it hit me. We still need to do our part.
It gets attention because it makes for good PR when they can release pictures like this. Its the same reason they release pictures of baby seals when they protest the seal hunt in Canada even though baby seals aren't whats being culled.
These folks, like peta, like the conveniently misrepresent the facts for their own fundraising efforts.
Edit: Majority almost always refers to an absolute majority of >50%. If OP means a plurality or relative majority, they should specify that. Not doing so is intentionally misleading.
Wikipedia specifically separates the two understandings, with majority (and more specifically simple majority) meaning a subset with more than half of the sets elements. The subset of apples is not more than half of the set. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/majority
That definition doesn't work though because I could just as easily say from your example that a majority of fruits are not apples and I would be just as correct because the sum of oranges and bananas is the greater number compared to apples.
Being wrong is embarrassing, but you are coming across as a real cocky piece of shit and it's a really simple word you can't understand. That word is used constantly in professional and scientific settings and it absolutely never means what you think it does. It means more than half. up votes and down votes and a three word definition you found on the internet and don't understand can't make you right.
Bruh I literally googled the oxford definition, it’s in the fucking dictionary.
Ofc I’m coming off as cocky, like 5 people came out of the woodworks to ‘correct’ this dude on his grammatically correct use of the word ‘majority’. They corrected him without even looking up the definition.
Majority, quite literally means ‘the bigger number’.
Majority means more than half. If there are more than two categories, and it's the largest, I believe the correct terms would be plurality or relative majority.
he used the % for just the nets, and misquoted the NatGeo article, but more than half of all garbage is indeed fishing gear which includes the nets which are 46% of the total by themselves
The study also found that fishing nets account for 46 percent of the trash, with the majority of the rest composed of other fishing industry gear, including ropes, oyster spacers, eel traps, crates, and baskets.
We all know that majority almost always means absolute majority. If that's not what OP meant, they should specify that they meant relative majority or plurality. Or, they could have included a percentage.
It's possible to technically be correct but also be intentionally misleading.
When does majority almost always mean absolute? We call pluralities in politics and racial percentages majorities all the time because nobody uses plurality.
Fair enough! I always think of majority as 50+1% and plurality as the most out of all options but you’re right, simple majority is the same as plurality
Well either you were blind af, because countless people share my opinion of their attitude all around the world. So much that South Park even had an episode about their doucheiness. Or, well, you're just one of them and you're just equally douchey but can't introspect. Time for some self reflection, mate.
I introspect plenty. Before I went to do my first brief stint welding on the Steve Irwin I was concerned that the people might be as you described. It wasn’t very hard to imagine that being the case. But I was very impressed with most of the crew. Intelligent people from many demographics and countries with honest concerns about the environment. Most people never mentioned (or hated) the TV show. Paul Watson’s name didn’t really come up that often either. I liked that because I was really worried about a cult of personality scene.
I fully imagined from the outset that the people is Sea Shepherd might be as you describe (some probably are), but my personal experiences over five years were quite the opposite. Just because countless people share an opinion does not make it valid. By the way most of us still enjoyed the South Park episode as well.
In the end it really is not that important. I am more concerned with the health of the ocean and the planet. Sea Shepherd and Greenpeace both do things to create publicity for these issues to make people aware of them. Both have done some dumb things on occasion. Things are not black and white.
Hmmm Vaquita was listed as endangered then as critically endangered in the 90's.
sea shepherd didn't do squat about them until they lost the whale wars with Japan and needed another cause they could beg money for. There is a term for what they are doing for the Vaquita: Too little, too late.
The founder of Sea Shepherd was also a founding member of Greenpeace but was kicked off the board because he didn't agree with their definition of "non-violence" if that tells you anything. Greenpeace has since called him a violent extremist and an eco-terrorist.
they euthanize a majority of animals that come in their shelters. like 99%
That part is not the problem. They euthanize animals because there is no one who can or will pay for their care. No kill shelters can exist because the vast majority of old, sick, and expensive animals go to shelters like PETA.
Everything else they do that you outlined is fucked up and I dislike PETA, but euthanizing animals is a necessary evil and we are lucky someone has the compassion to do it.
I know this may sound bad, but someday I hope society will advance enough where we have the same compassion for humans and allow for euthanasia of the terminally ill.
There is also some instances where they took pets and euthanized them onto the day. I read about one instance where they had been invited to capture semi feral cats. They had spoken with a family but came back later and tried to lure their dog onto public properly which failed so they went onto their porch to grab it. It was euthanized the same day.
I think they also tried to see if the family could be illegals when they sued.
They reportedly ignore collars and tags on animals and euthanize as fast as they can despite legal waiting periods.
Aside from that they also sued David Slater for the monkey selfie....
Both examples are ones I have read about the legal proceedings but since I don't live in the US it is all just things people described. Both did re-homing so probably true but it comes down to them not believing in humans having pets.
I am sure it makes sense from their point of view.
^^ Related to this, my neighbor called me telling me an animal control officer was trying to lure my dog (with an electronic fence, by the way) off of my property and into the street.
The Mayor got a phone call, names of said officer and the witness in hand. The message from me was very simple: my dog is a member of my family, and luring a member of my family is a form of kidnap in my mind.
I was refinishing floors at a bed and breakfast a few addresses down from PETA HQ. We had a contractor's dumpster in the parking lot and one day there was a bunch of people standing around the dumpster. My first thought was a dead body and I was kind of right. They found a bunch of dead dogs in garbage bags. That shit still haunts me to this day.
So you are saying that Japan removing themselves from the IWC and not whaling for "scientific" research has nothing to do from the immense pressure by Sea Shepherd?
So you are saying that Japan removing themselves from the IWC and not whaling for "scientific" research has nothing to do with the immense pressure by Sea Shepherd?
sea shepherd lost the "whale wars" with Japan and gave up interfering with them a couple of years before Japan decided to leave the IWC and resume commercial whaling.
The Sea Shepherd deck crew pulled those fishing nets up by hand on Operation Milagro. And yes, the women in the picture DID pull them up to as she was the bosun.The nets are set by poachers inside the Zero Tolerance Area in the upper gulf of the sea of cortez. Each year 100's of illegal poachers funded by the Chinese and Mexican cartels fish for the local seabass the 'totababa'. The swim bladders are smuggled out of the country and sold in China for 100K per kg.The real issue is the vaquita porpoise. It is the smallest porpoise in the world, and endemic to the area. They get caught in the nets and die :/Sea Shepherd crew have operating campaigns for the last seven years, pulling up these nets to ensure the vaquita survive.Sea Shepherd is there at the invitation of the Mexican government and works with them to protect the vaquita.
Edit: Can't internet good, and in fact, did not hijack top comment.
Your comment seems to be very informative, and I think puts the provided image into context. I think the title of the original post is incredibly misleading.
Not to nitpick, but I'm gonna nitpick. There are some rules regarding manoruverability of vessels, however between two (unencumbered) power driven vessels outside of a shipping lane no such rule exists. It is however illegal to purposely cause a collision in the same way that a car pulling out in front of a transport truck would be in the wrong not because it's more maneuverable but because it put itself into the collision
Fair enough, thanks gor the clarification. You should watch the footage. They basically parked it in the path of a giant whaling ship for the purpose of suing for damages in the hopes of financially hurting the whaling company.
Yeah thats such a backwards and thoughtless way to go about it, not to mention the fact that a sinking ship itself is an environmental disaster. I've studied the Farley Mowat/Des Groseilliers incident and it's quite insane how they behave
Yeah, I know what you mean, I used to live in Fremantle and while I might not be as hippie/alternative as most there I am still big on the importance of environmental health, but these guys, they always seemed a little off to me.
Yeah my mom met one of them on a trip to Bali, said the dude was a total tool, and was doing nothing to actually fix the issues they claim to be fighting.
I wanna qualify this by saying that I've got nothing but respect and admiration for people who go out of their way to try and protect the planet. That being said...
It's not the message itself, it's the DELIVERY of the message that will sink you every. single. time. Take the high road. These guys are often the way not to influence people and make change.
I used to hate watch Whale Wars (the sea Shepard’s TV show on animal planet). From what I saw and hear from others they deserve all the hate they get. Two instances I remember are when they attacked a Japanese whaling ship by throwing glass bottles of chemical solutions meant to putrefy the whale meat onto the ship. They got a call from the ship asking them to stop because one fisherman got hit in the head and had suffered a really bad concussion. They didn’t because the fishermen were “obviously lying”. Second their leader always goes below deck on their little raids to “strategize”. He does this every single time and one time he wore a bullet proof vest because he was concerned the fishermen would start shooting at them. So after the battle he comes back up and in the middle of a meeting feels around his vest and finds a bullet in it. He uses this to try to say the fishermen were shooting at them. There are a few problems with this. The whole encounter was filmed and not a single gunshot was heard. He was below deck the whole time. The only person wearing a bullet proof vest just happens to be the only one that got shot at. No other bullets were ever found.
They meet every definition of eco terrorist and don’t deserve people’s sympathy. Much less their donations.
I agree with you 1000%. I once took a tour of the Steve Irwin, during which a crew member described how they throw ziplock bags of rancid butter to spoil the meat. Then he showed us a video of an encounter and we could all clearly see their crew throwing beer bottles and big nuts and bolts. Everything they do seems to be dangerous.
As an example, this photo shows a girl standing on what seems to be a large amount of net. It isn't. To get a feel for the scope and learn about some folks that are actually trying to make a dent and not just fill their instagram feed, check out NOAA's Marine Debris Project or the Papahanaumokuakea Marine Debris Project. This photo is basically just someone wanting social media likes for picking up a soda bottle.
People who pick up trash deserve to be praised. Are you honestly saying that that woman, boat, and org don't deserve praise because they didn't pick up as many nets as NOAA?
I saw the japanese whaling crash on youtube. It was so cringey. They purposely hit them and then cried. It's one thing if someone has footage of them ramming the ship. But its another thing to have your own camera record everything. Fuck the whaling ships, but they endangered their own crew and the other crew.
When I was living in Hobart, they were giving tours of the Steve Irwin and giving each other pats on the back. Just a big circle jerk. They were showing the footage of the ramming to ppl on the tours and everyone was like "dude! Wtf!?" Cringey is right!
I worked on a couple of seasons or Whale Wars. These people are crazy!!! To them you have to be willing to die for the whales. Watson thinks his crew is expendable while he wears a bullet proof vest. To fake getting shot. This is speculation from working on season 1. I have no official proof but we all thought it was super sus when doing the show.
The one who boarded the Japanese ship was Peter Bethune.
He was facing many years in prison from all the charges filed against him.
Paul Watson would never put himself in such danger. In fact he jumped bail (money that was donated, not his own) in Germany and ran away and hid after he was arrested there.
A lot of us on the crew watched that moment to find out how it happened. I just remember it didn’t add up. He was dodging cameras and oddly the only man with a bulletproof vest was shot. When the whole crew was there creating havoc. Since it would cost me millions to take footage from a production and post it I can only say my opinion. I’m legally not allowed to speak in absolutes. So take that as you want. In the end he’s well know for being crazy and pulling stunts.
I agree about all other things you said accept the “legal seagull cull.” Whaling is legal in other countries, but that doesn’t make it okay. Same thing with the seagulls.
Seals, not seagulls.
Firstly it's the harp seal, not endangered at all.
Secondly, yes there is an annual commercial cull that's pretty harsh when they cull the babies. But instead of interfering with that, Sea Shepherds interfered with an Inuit seal hunt. Our first nations peoples retain hunting rights the rest of us don't have. Ain't nobody gonna come over and stop FNMI from hunting for food.
Basically SS fucked w a small first nation hunt for food instead of a big commercial cull.
They also interfered with a legal whale hunt from the Makah tribe in WA. A tribe that retained their rights to whaling when they joined the US and stopped by themselves when the whale population was in jeopardy, a whale population that has since rebounded.
Since it’s necessary for the Inuit people to get food, it’s a bad thing to prevent them from doing so, so I agree. You didn’t make that distinction and just called a “legal seal cull” totally fine.
Paul Watson was and is the “King Asshole,Moron”. He sailed around raising shit to raise more money, to sail around raising more shit.Non profits are a good living for some people.Cheap labor also with actual caring people willing to volunteer at their own expense.
Do something good before you shit on others who do. Might be they fail sometimes, but they are also the only organization I know that actively defends the ocean.
So looking at that pile of trash, is nice to see that it's not in the ocean anymore, but do they recycle it and turn it into something useful or do they just take it to a landfill which is, probably, another blight for nature.
This is just my thoughts I have no knowledge of whether landfills are good or not, I'm just assuming they aren't because it's mostly trash that doesn't really biodegrade.
Oh I'm not sure tbh.
I also love that this trash isn't in our ocean anymore, I just loathe the organization this young woman is representing and Iwanted to shine some light on their poor practices.
I used to look up to groups like green peace and Peta, but then I started learning about the darker shit they do and pretty much stopped. I appreciate their desire to protect the environment and animals but they do some really stupid shit. As happy as I am to see that trash being removed from the water, unless the plan on recycling it themselves it's just going to go into a landfill, which might be a little better than the ocean but my guess is environmentally it's not that much better.
Because we also see the shitty things they do so we become pessimistic and see no reason to give them the benefit of the doubt. For all the good they may do, those groups also do plenty of shitty things.
I have to disagree. Sea shepherd do plenty of wonderful things and are crewed by compassionate and kind humans. Not sure the last time you researched what they are doing or set foot on a ship to see for yourself.
Easy to type negative comments, but harder for you to actually get out there and protect the ocean.
Have you read the thread that you commenting on? It seems full if examples of the stupid shit they have done. I'm not discounting the work they do that actually benefits the planet, I'm saying that while they may do that, they also do stupid shit that turns people off of thier message and work.
And you're absolutely right, I'm a lazy fuck who doesn't go out and clean up the ocean on a regular basis, but I also don't harass people who I disagree with. Some of what they do may be warranted but I don't think you can say that everything they do is warranted. Do you regularly go out and clean up the environment? Good for you, I've done it a quite a few time when I was younger, but now I'm a bitter old man who just doesn't give a fuck anymore.
The world is going to hell in a handbrake, and the ones who really need to clean up their acts are the corporations. From what I can see, the amount of good that a group of people can do is heavily outweighed by the amount of horrible that corporations do. I'm just hoping to die before it gets really bad, and I'm glad I haven't brought any kids into the world to make me worry about thier futures.
got their boat, the MV Farley Mowat impounded. They never claimed it back and now face a law suit for abandoning a derelict vessel
I agree that these guys seem terrible from the context of your comment, whether they are or not remains to be seen, but how is this specific issue their fault?
Are you required to claim an impounded vehicle? I would assume that if it was impounded it is now in the possession of some company and it would be their responsibility to take the vessel out of the water or to keep it from leaking oil into the water.
I just don't understand how they could be held responsible for "abandoning a derelict vessel" when they were not in possession of it due to it being impounded.
It's generally not legal to abandon a boat. Source.
Sea Shepard is claiming that they intentionally provoked the seizure as a means of disposing of a vessil that was too expensive to maintain. Source.
“The Farley Mowat had reached a stage where we had to retire the ship. The annual dry-docking charges to keep the ship running was becoming a burden and the ship was much too slow for continued use in the Southern Oceans. It is expensive to retire a ship however, especially an old ship so we had to find a way to retire the Farley without added expense. ...” Captain Watson said.
Sea Shepard is just a bunch of confrontational assholes that are more concerned with self promotion than actual conservation.
By maritime law do you mean the Navigation Rules and Regulations (COLREGS)? The first rule is actually “Applicability” whereby Rule 1(a) states: “These rules shall apply to all vessels upon the high seas and in all waters connected therewith by navigable seagoing vessels.”
Perhaps not prudent (see Rule 2), but certainly not the first rule. Admiralty courts would have held both vessels liable.
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u/some_canadian_dude Aug 12 '21 edited Aug 12 '21
Sea Shepherds have great ideals and do good things but they're so fucking dumb and they're a bunch of fucking assholes.
I lived in Hobart, where they would make port and they'd cause so much trouble in town, bullying ppl, getting in fights etc. They think they're badass but they're idiots.
Sacrificing their million dollar stealth speedboat the My Ady Gil by parking it in the way of a whaling ship and hoping to take them to court for damages, they forgot the first rule of maritime law; the least maneuverable ship has the right of way. They lost that case.
They tried stopping a legal seal cull in Canada and got their boat, the MV Farley Mowat impounded. They never claimed it back and now face a law suit for abandoning a derelict vessel that's leaking oil everywhere.
They took a video trying to show a Japanese whaling ship ramming them, yet it's clear that the SS ship, The Steve Irwin, is the ones changing course to purposely collide with the whaling ship.
They board other ships in international waters (piracy) and whine and cry when they get detained in a brig and brought back to face a court.
They have wasted soooo much money donated to them by benefactors.
Seriously, it's as though they're all kids playing with boats in a bathtub. Idiots.
EDIT:typo EDIT 2: another typo lol