r/technology Oct 01 '22 Narwhal Salute 1 Wholesome Seal of Approval 1 Silver 2

Time to Switch Back to Firefox-Chrome’s new ad-blocker-limiting extension platform will launch in 2023 Privacy

https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/09/chromes-new-ad-blocker-limiting-extension-platform-will-launch-in-2023/
33.1k Upvotes

3.4k

u/MetalliMyers Oct 01 '22

This was rumored a long time ago and that was when I switched back to Firefox. I switched to chrome because at the time Firefox had become bloated. Then this was rumored and chrome became very resource intensive. Been on Firefox again for a while now and it’s been great.

1.2k

u/Ghi102 Oct 01 '22

I've been on Firefox for years, but I wouldn't say the experience is always great. Most of the time it is, but there's always this website where a feature is broken on Firefox but not on Chrome so I always need to keep a backup Chrome browser running for these websites that implement something non-standard

461

u/VoteMe4Dictator Oct 01 '22

Same. Firefox for routine use with ad blockers and privacy add ons. Chrome for the one website a week that this breaks and I care enough to still use.

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u/slickwombat Oct 01 '22

Consider using NoScript for Firefox as well. It obviously prevents lots of sites from working as intended, but this turns out be mostly a good thing: no soft paywalls, subscription/cookie preference modals, etc. For when a site actually needs Javascript, just add an exemption or use your alternative browser.

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u/Platypuslord Oct 02 '22

And Ublock Origin, BlockTube, Privacy Bager, Decentraleyes and ForgetmeNot

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u/Khanstant Oct 01 '22

Haha I use Edge for when Chrome won't work with a site properly or if all the privacy and ad blockers just break some shitty site.

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u/bmccorm2 Oct 01 '22

I’ve been back on Firefox since the quantum engine and had a pretty good experience so far. Would never go back to chrome :)

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u/zSprawl Oct 01 '22 edited Oct 02 '22

Firefox Containers is where it’s at.

https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/containers

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u/karbonkel1 Oct 01 '22

Yes, and there's nothing comparable (no, not profiles)

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u/Thaufas Oct 01 '22

I doubt that Google will ever introduce containers because they are antithetical to Google's business model. If Google ever does introduce something resembling containers, I'll be very suspicious.

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u/viperex Oct 02 '22

Imagine combining profiles and containers. My tab hoarding would know no bounds

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u/pca1987 Oct 02 '22

I want that for Firefox on Android so bad

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u/Bluest_waters Oct 01 '22

wtf is that?

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u/phaemoor Oct 01 '22

You can have different "contexts" in one browser window. E.g. you can open the same site multiple times with different logins. It's a godsend when I have 3 jiras and 567 aws consoles open.

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u/rcook55 Oct 02 '22

What? Shit you just made my day. I hate having a rugular user and admin user browser. This is great!

10

u/lesChaps Oct 02 '22

Ah, a fellow plumber.

5

u/propostor Oct 02 '22

Ok that's awesome. Firefox time for me. I abandoned it when Quantum came out because it fucked all my saved passwords. Think I'll give it another go now.

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u/bedlam_au Oct 01 '22

It's like Chrome profiles but at the tab level. Isolated instances with their own cookies so you can have multiple sessions of the same website with different log ins.

Also helpful to use Facebook exclusively in one so it doesn't contaminate the rest of your browsing. If you're still using Facebook...

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u/bmccorm2 Oct 02 '22

They isolate cookies - and hence sites ability to track you. So you would use google/facebook in one container and then shopping in another and those companies will not be able to track you all over the web and spam you with adverts.

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u/atomicwrites Oct 01 '22 edited Oct 02 '22

TBF I've also had things break in chrome and work in Firefox. Really at this point a site that only work is one engine is just broken, it's not like the dark ages when each browser was wildly different and supporting multiple was hard. The one exception is sites that need experimental APIs, for example WebBluetooth is not in FF yet.

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u/MetalliMyers Oct 01 '22 edited Oct 01 '22

Yes, I agree. However Edge would also work in this case.

Edit: Chrome, Brave, Edge, or any chromium based browser. Don’t want to sound like an Edge shill since it does have its downsides.

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u/silqii Oct 01 '22

Turn that vpn off on edge lol. It’s sketchy as hell. Never trust when someone is willing to give you free bandwidth

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u/JimWilliams423 Oct 01 '22

Never trust when someone is willing to give you free bandwidth

If you're using a commercially developed browser that you didn't pay anything for, its already too late to worry about being the product.

I'd take a microsoft-vetted free vpn over any other free vpn and over any fly-by-night paid vpn. At least they have a reputational interest to preserve.

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u/MetalliMyers Oct 01 '22

For sure, you are the product at that point. Install wireguard in a docker container if you want more privacy away from home.

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u/Zen1_618 Oct 01 '22

please explain, there is a vpn in edge?

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u/rohmish Oct 01 '22

It's a new thing they're rolling out in partnership with CloudFlare. It's essentially the 1.1.1.1 VPN built in to edge.

7

u/natufian Oct 01 '22

It's essentially the 1.1.1.1 VPN built in to edge.

To what degree is Cloudflare actually sus? I think I use 1.1.1.1 as one of the DNS resolvers for my pi-hole, and if I'm not mistaken Firefox uses it for in-browser DNS resolution as well (which is on by default).

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u/DragonQ0105 Oct 01 '22

What sites? I've literally never had this problem.

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u/RucITYpUti Oct 01 '22

I love Firefox, but I've had some issues in the past. Recently, I wasn't able to load Google sites (Gmail, Google Search, Sheets) for several weeks. No idea why. It seems to have resolved.

I'm my estimation, though, it's usually less about Firefox being bad or buggy, and more about the complexities of a bunch of extensions or privacy features sometimes breaking the spyware that so many sites run.

I'm okay with that trade-off.

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u/mrjackspade Oct 01 '22

It wasn't "rumored", it was announced years ago because they give developers years to update as part of their depreciation schedule.

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u/MetalliMyers Oct 01 '22

Good point, couldn’t remember the details from when I switched. I just know the news at the time had me nope out of Chrome pretty quickly.

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u/life359 Oct 01 '22

I think you mean deprecation.

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u/goodswimma Oct 01 '22

This is precisely why monopolies are actively discouraged and regulated against. Consumers typically tend to suffer as a result. Browser choices beyond Safari and Chromium based browsers should also be encouraged and Firefox provides a solid and noteworthy alternative.

475

u/PizzaCatLover Oct 01 '22

I switched back to Firefox a few years ago and honestly I can't imagine switching back. It's great. I really appreciate their focus on privacy.

126

u/slydjinn Oct 01 '22

I have always come back because of all sorts of reasons, but this time I am staying here. No matter how many new whatevers Edge and Chrome throw in, I am never watching ads on my PC. Didn't pay so much for a 3070 to watch ads on it.

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u/RaindropBebop Oct 01 '22

I really like Firefox on mobile, like a lot. Firefox on desktop is sort of a wash, though, with the Edge going to Chrome.

If this change goes through next year and adblockers truly won't work on Chrome, that'll tip the scales and I'll make the switch.

Google - I pay for YouTube Premium I don't block ads so I can get "free" shit, as Linus would say. I block ads so I can browse the web safe from malicious ads, clearly differentiate between legitimate site content and advertisements pretending to be site content, and prevent my browser from literally being hijacked by ads. Until that's not the case, I will continue to need an ad blocker.

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u/Sokonit Oct 01 '22

Firefox on desktop is sort of a wash,

In my experience Firefox has two things that ar beter than chrome in UX. Tab cycling and reopening closed windows.

Whenever I go back to chrome and try to cycle through tabs I cry. Also good luck reopening a closed window on Chrome without reopening any closed tabs.

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u/RaindropBebop Oct 02 '22

Idk, Chrome has a drop down now for tabs, and I've never had any issues with ctrl+shift+t to bring back a window I just closed. Not sure if FF does it differently, but that's my experience w/ Chrome.

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4.3k

u/FoggyBottom4u Oct 01 '22

Switch back? I've never left. Firefox on pc and mobile with ublock origin rules! I never see ads.

113

u/SeasonedCitizen Oct 01 '22

This and/or NoScript. I like the simple granular control.

33

u/touristtam Oct 01 '22

Add privacy badger, cookie auto delete and decentraleyes. Don't forget to enable account containers.

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u/decon89 Oct 01 '22

No need for privacy badger when using ublock origin (at least from what my research have found). Cookie auto del is great. Read somewhere that decentraleyes is useless in practice so I disabled it after having used it for years.

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u/ttonster2 Oct 02 '22

You autodelete cookies?? Doesn’t that mean none of your accounts remain logged in and your passwords/progress is never saves

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u/[deleted] Oct 01 '22

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u/m0rris0n_hotel Oct 01 '22

It’s great. Isn’t it? I’ve been team Firefox for well over a decade and I’ll gladly stick with it as long as I can.

I really think it’s steadily improved over the years. That’s been my experience at any rate

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u/DingleBerrieIcecream Oct 01 '22

After using Firefox with Ublock and other ad blockers for 10 years, couldn’t be happier. Was looking over my friends shoulder on his laptop and couldn’t believe how many ads he looks at on a daily basis. I didn’t realize that so many people in the world have this version of the Internet. This is the version that Google prefers obviously.

Firefox all the way.

24

u/freeagency Oct 01 '22

It is ironic that on metered connections, you're paying to have those bloated non mobile friendly ads served to you. Eating all of those precious bytes of "high speed" data.

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u/ScottColvin Oct 01 '22

It's like watching antenna tv with all the ads. Why do people do that to themselves?

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u/IAmAnAudity Oct 01 '22

Worse. Many people BUY cable tv which has the same amount of ads. They pay to watch them, it’s crazy.

15

u/12AngryKernals Oct 01 '22

People buy cable and then still watch many of the same channels that they could get for free with an antenna. I looked at getting cable once, and the basic package that cost about $40 was mostly local channels or streams of the same channel from a different time zone. To get any channels I wanted would be well over $100, packaged with hundreds of channels I have zero interest in.

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u/misterfast Oct 01 '22

For local channels and better quality broadcasts for sporting events since the signal is uncompressed. For ads, it's either DVR or mute button.

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u/ScottColvin Oct 01 '22

I remember back in the day. You always had a backup channel to watch while commercials played. Then you would forget to switch back, until they had commercials. No wonder this world is a little schizophrenic.

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u/CraftyFellow_ Oct 01 '22 Silver

I swear they started synchronizing commercial timings.

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u/BrothelWaffles Oct 01 '22

I'd honestly be fine with ads if it wasn't for a) how damn long some of them are, b) how frequent they are, and c) the data collection and content manipulation that goes along with the ads. I get that content providers have to get money from somewhere, but they don't have to be so damn obnoxious and unethical about it.

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u/TehBanzors Oct 01 '22

I've always been a Firefox user and fan despite using Chrome and Firefox interchangeably at one point based on whichever browser performed better for a specific site...

I can gladly say I stopped caring about the minor difference in speed loading a page and have used Firefox exclusively for the last 6 months. No plans on going back, and this news just further cements that.

Please spread the word Firefox > chrome

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u/birdboix Oct 01 '22

100%, they definitely fell off the first half of 2010 but anyone reading this who dismissed Firefox before Quantum came out really needs to go check it out because Quantum is easily the best browser on the market and has been since release

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u/Kthonic Oct 01 '22

What is quantum?

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u/Razakel Oct 01 '22

They rewrote a lot of the core engine.

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u/Glomgore Oct 01 '22

Yep, 20 year FF user here. Original FF was a fork of the NetScape code set. Obv over the years this didnt hold up well. They built the backend of the whole browser for modern standards, including native Facebook containment.

Mozilla does great work!

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u/boston_homo Oct 01 '22

I remember using Firebird before it became Firefox

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u/Pushbrown Oct 01 '22

I switched to Firefox recently after they announced the no ad block thing, it's been great, ads are out of control...

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u/firemage22 Oct 01 '22

well over a decade

Netscape- Mozilla Suite - Firefox been in the same ecosystem since the 90s

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u/EndersGame Oct 01 '22

Netscape navigator, oh that brings back memories. I was using Firefox when it was still Phoenix or Firebird, forget which was first. I've been with Chrome for a minute but I'll switch back no problem if ad-blocking becomes an issue.

Happy cake day my friend.

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u/swizzler Oct 01 '22

Plus the built in features chrome doesn't have, like pop-out picture-in-picture videos. So handy to pop out a youtube video, stick it in a corner, and then switch to another tab or program to watch while you do without needing to deal with a whole-ass webpage, titlebar, etc.

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u/aaOzymandias Oct 01 '22

Been using Firefox since version 1, or there about, almost two decades now. It is a great browser all in all.

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u/Luvs_to_drink Oct 01 '22

Except when apps use Chrome despite Firefox being set as default because mobile

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u/najodleglejszy Oct 01 '22

many such apps have a setting to turn it off, sometimes called "use [Chrome] custom tabs" (which should be disabled), or "use external browser" (which, of course, should be enabled).

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u/Luvs_to_drink Oct 01 '22

Or they could you know just use THE FUCKING DEFAULT BROWSER BY DEFAULT. Why do I need to tell an app to use my default browser via settings in the first place?

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u/najodleglejszy Oct 01 '22

because some of them can track every interaction of yours when visiting a website using their built-in browser, including what elements you tap on or what do you write in the text fields https://www.forbes.com/sites/richardnieva/2022/08/18/tiktok-in-app-browser-research/

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u/Hokulewa Oct 01 '22

I'm sure Google rewards them for it.

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u/diito Oct 01 '22

As someone else that never left....

It's shocking a browser controlled by a corporation that generates its revenue from collecting data about users and selling ads would do something anti user like this. /s

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u/robotteeth Oct 01 '22

I left firefox in like 2008 when chrome came out, because it was bloated as fuck at that time and legitimately slow. I switched back like a year or two ago when it became evident that chrome wanted to get rid of adblock and I heard Firefox no longer had those issues. I'm not sure what your timeframe is here, but firefox legitimately had problems for a while which caused a lot of people to jump ship.

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u/WhizBangPissPiece Oct 01 '22

Same here. "Back in my day" Firefox had an insane memory leak. Run that in conjunction with Vista and you had a bad time. Chrome was a much lighter browser back then, though 14 years ago most people didnt have 100 tabs open at a time

I'll wait and see because I do like how chrome works across multiple devices which I know is a security issue, but my god is it convenient.

I switched once though, and I can switch again.

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u/starkistuna Oct 01 '22

Chrome was better then because it was the extension king, everything came for it first, then they started blocking extensions that did stuff they did not agree and their browsers started eating ridiculous amounts of memory and everyone started going back to firefox

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u/damontoo Oct 01 '22

Chrome was better then because it was the extension king, everything came for it first

Not only is this not true, Google basically paid for developers to abandon Firefox extension development. Most notably they hired the lead firebug developer to work on Chrome's dev tools.

Even chrome itself is a result of Google abusing their relationship with Mozilla and trying to cut them out as a middleman so they didn't have to pay them so much money every year for search. They started paying the salary of some Firefox developers and when the community raised concerns or objections they claimed they were just doing it to be philanthropic and help improve the web. Then it was revealed they had been put to work on Google's new browser and they quit working for Mozilla.

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u/moonra_zk Oct 01 '22

Yup, I went back to Firefox when Chrome blocked an amazing YouTube extension I used. First they removed it from the store but you could still use it manually, but then they blocked it completely and I switched back to FF.

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u/[deleted] Oct 01 '22

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u/ChicagoAdmin Oct 01 '22

Yeah, I think the share of people who actually care about ad blocking is far smaller than this thread implies.

Even smaller is the population of folks who would move browsers to then implement such a feature.

I say this as an IT professional who sees business users comprise a large part of those metrics.

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u/[deleted] Oct 01 '22 edited Oct 02 '22

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u/starkistuna Oct 01 '22

everyone that cares about memory usage and browser control and blocking.

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u/Zachs_Butthole Oct 01 '22

Don't forget the profile sync, I think chrome had that one for a while. That and extensions were the reason I switched. I might be switching back now I just need to dedicate some time to getting all my extensions and profiles moved over and on all my devices.

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u/myyummyass Oct 01 '22

Does Firefox mobile for iOS allow the use of ublock?

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u/_Oce_ Oct 01 '22

No, and it's because Apple doesn't let them install add-ons. https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/add-ons-firefox-ios

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u/FatalElectron Oct 01 '22

Firefox on iOS is just a wrapper around a webkit window anyway, it's still safari essentially, just with different menus

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u/MalHeartsNutmeg Oct 01 '22

This is true for all browsers on iOS in case anyone was thinking of trying another browser.

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u/[deleted] Oct 01 '22

I believe only Firefox Focus on iOS does native ad-blocking. Regular Firefox may not.

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u/PlatinumSif Oct 01 '22

I just use Adguard and it works fine

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u/raggedtoad Oct 01 '22

Yeah, I left Firefox for Chrome when it first came out, but I switched back to FF a few years ago primarily because of mobile having actual AdBlock. I have a phone plan that charges per GB, so it literally saves me money not loading a bunch of garbage ad content on mobile.

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u/Jokershigh Oct 01 '22

Same, Firefox on PC with No Script and Ublock Origin are my gold standard

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u/nekozuki Oct 01 '22

Exactly. Already there, baby. Their fencing in of FB is amazing, too! And my fans don’t run so crazy when I use it on my desktop vs Chrome.

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u/segagamer Oct 01 '22

I can see it now, a return to the 90's.

"This page will only work on Chrome v110 or compatible browsers"

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u/Xeno_man Oct 01 '22

This page has been optimized for Netscape Navigator.

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u/LeamNoran Oct 01 '22

There are already sites like that. Banking sites will cry about Firefox being unsupported, streaming media sites like directv stream won’t stream, some sites will refuse to load at all unless it is “supported”.

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u/0O00O0O00O Oct 02 '22

And when using an add-on to spoof your browser, surprise surprise, they still work.

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u/lzwzli Oct 02 '22

This is already happening. Many pages already explicitly say works best on chrome.

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u/joeyo1423 Oct 01 '22

Like all products, it starts out great, and then deteriorates as the people in control of the product look to squeeze out every last dime. Even my friggin garbage bags! These things were the king's of the trash bag world. Now they tear constantly because or a "new formula" in making them. Gotta keep changing just about everything, from trash bags to internet browsers, every few years or so

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u/illessen Oct 01 '22

New formula is just code for using cheaper materials to raise the price even more than they planned.

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u/Drakoala Oct 01 '22

Just like how "new look" in physical goods translates to "we shrunk the box just right so that our focus groups didn't notice."

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u/CaneVandas Oct 01 '22

Google's entire business model is on selling ad space. I can imagine their customers have been getting a bit testy when Google allows customers to block the very ads they are paying for on Google's own browser.

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u/mindbleach Oct 01 '22

The root issue being, "allow" has nothing to do with it.

It's your fucking computer.

It does what you want or it goes in the trash.

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u/CaneVandas Oct 01 '22

There is nobody saying you can't use a different browser. Just saying that Google is being scrutinized by the people paying them money for undermining that sale in their own published software.

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u/Expensive_Finger_973 Oct 01 '22

I think Google is right at the start of where most large companies get to after awhile, where it is advisable to use them for what they have proven to be good at that no one else smaller is really providing as feature equivalent a product for and ignore or get away from everything else.

Past a certain point most companies lose sight of making the best product they can while making a profit from it and switches to trying to extracting the most profit for as little effort as possible.

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u/Starklet Oct 01 '22

Seriously though, why is it so damn hard to find good garbage bags these days

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u/Everkeen Oct 01 '22

You have to specifically look for contractor bags that list the thickness. Home depot and the like have them. You can get 0.5mm ones if you want something seriously strong.

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u/mjh215 Oct 01 '22

5 mil, not .5mm. A mil is one-thousandth of an inch. To get .5mm you would have to buy 20 mil bags and the heaviest contractor bags I've seen are like 7 or 8 mil.

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u/Old_comfy_shoes Oct 01 '22

It's honestly infuriating. It's because for the economy to fiction the way it is we need growth, and everyone is highly motivated to make growth, so they keep changing everything. Sometimes it's an improvement. But it usually ends up running everything.

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u/JuggerKnot86 Oct 01 '22

does this apply to chromiums?

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u/DarraignTheSane Oct 01 '22

Yes, and every browser based off of it - Edge, Opera, etc.

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u/jack-w2 Oct 02 '22

Don’t know if it’s true but Brave claimed a while back it wouldn’t affect them because they build the ad blocking completely into the source code of their chromium based browser. It doesn’t actually use an extension so they say they aren’t at risk

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u/milesbelli Oct 02 '22

Yeah unless I'm really missing something, any chromium based browser that implements a built-in ad-blocker really ought not be impacted by this.

Third-party ad-blockers running in those browsers definitely would be, though.

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u/Doktor_Earrape Oct 01 '22

Does that include Opera GX too? I'd hate to have to abandon it, it's been a great browser so far

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u/Tech_Itch Oct 01 '22

Honestly, you should probably abandon it anyway. Opera is now owned by a Chinese company whose owner's other business is predatory payday loans, and that other company has been accused of a bunch of privacy violations.

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u/Doktor_Earrape Oct 01 '22

Damn for real? I had no idea...

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u/Sa404 Oct 02 '22

Brave is also involved in a lot of sketchy stuff lately

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u/stolid_agnostic Oct 01 '22

This is my fear. I’ve standardized on it.

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u/K3vin_Norton Oct 02 '22

Brave is doing their own separate add-on store to try to get around it but they also from what I've heard inject ads into websites (?), so I'm not very confident for how good their adblock will be.

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u/nox66 Oct 01 '22

In principle yes, unless those organizations start maintaining a parallel fork. Which I doubt in most cases, but it's possible.

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u/MalHeartsNutmeg Oct 01 '22

Mentioned it before but Microsoft has deep pockets, Edge has been a really attractive option for Chrome users and Microsoft are desperate for marketshare. They could be a player in this.

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u/DiscrepancyAnalyst Oct 01 '22

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u/caerphoto Oct 01 '22

Right?

OP, repeat after me: hyphens are not the same as dashes.

They’re an acceptable substitute but only if you put spaces around them, otherwise it looks like you’ve written a compound word. Like wtf is “Firefox-Chrome”? Some kind of blighted hellspawned offspring of an unholy union betwixt two browsers?

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u/BoyVanderlay Oct 02 '22

Ah my favourite internet browser, Firefox-Chrome!

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u/rabbitofrevelry Oct 02 '22

I hear they have a new ad-blocker-limiting extension platform that everyone is switching to

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u/ConsciousWhirlpool Oct 01 '22

Already there and not looking back.

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u/pizoisoned Oct 01 '22

Chrome was always going to be problematic when it came to ads because Googles core business is advertising. The fact that they’re also controlling other sections of the browser market via chromium is not going to help things either. I’m not saying I love Firefox as it has its share of compatibility issues, but I generally trust a non-profit to be less shitty than a publicly traded corporation.

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u/phaemoor Oct 01 '22

Compatibility issues on some sites are only present because the site itself uses non-standard code which is allowed in Chrome, but not in FF. It's IE all over again.

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u/lzwzli Oct 01 '22

Exactly. Chrome is the new IE...

Google has become the thing that it was meant to eliminate...

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u/barrystrawbridgess Oct 01 '22

Google wants their money.

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u/AintAintAWord Oct 01 '22

Don't Be Evil™ Fuck Yeah, Get That Bread™

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u/Logothetes Oct 01 '22

Google did quite a bait and switch on us. I used to be such a fan. The way it turned out broke my heart.

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u/[deleted] Oct 01 '22

They have pretty much failed at every revenue generating venture they have launched that isn't advertising. Their cloud services efforts trail massively trail AWS and also sit behind Azure. Their hardware efforts haven't gained traction for a variety of reasons. It's a tough go for them to make massive inroads with Workspace in Government due to Microsoft's dominance in that space.

I still use a lot of Google services (Email, YouTube, Search mostly), but this hardline tactic isn't surprising when you consider Wall-Street always needs massive quarterly growth and Pichai has failed at every initiative to diversify the company.

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u/WoodTrophy Oct 01 '22

I imagine making this move towards ad blockers will just make people not use their browser.. that’s not good for revenue. I think that the majority of people this would “affect” are the people who don’t know about using other browsers. I really doubt that audience knows what an ad blocker is, either. Am I missing something, or is whoever made this decision to block ads dumb?

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u/kj4ezj Oct 01 '22

Actually, this is good for Google on multiple fronts- to a point.

The people using ad blockers are not a source of income for Google for the most part, so pissing them off is not harmful to Google. Moreover, Google actually partly funds FireFox development because they have such dominance in the browser space that they are afraid of antitrust. They need competitors. Driving up Firefox market share with users who don't earn them revenue benefits them. If they drive enough users to Firefox they can even stop funding it.

The only exception to this is that Google Chrome specifically sends a ton of information back to Google about you and your computer even if you do use an ad blocker, so they lose there. But that is probably not a significant value if they can't show you ads.

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u/Expensive_Finger_973 Oct 01 '22

I don't think Google have the corporate will or clout with share holders to take a long term strategy with anything that does not serve the aims of the ads business fairly directly.

For better or worse Microsoft is very very good at enterprise scale products and services that a company would consider a foundational pillar of their tech stack compared to most. I would argue that AWS is about the only real competition they have there these days. I think VMWare may fall off here over time after the Broadcom acquisition. So it would take Google a lot of effort, investment, and money to overcome that. If they even could with as rigid as enterprise can be.

And Apple and Samsung are generally very very good at user level hardware. And if Apple has proven one thing over the last decade it is that once you get a consumer, you generally have to work really hard to get them to go through the inconvenience to leave if they are not turned off almost immediately.

I think the future of Google is mostly software services like Youtube, Maps, search, Gmail etc. This grey layer of things that people want, but generally are not willing to spend much if any money on. That is the places where ads can thrive.

Outside of that the smartest place Google should spend their time is things like Android, Chromium, ChromeOS, and Play services. Things that are more building blocks to products than products themselves. Then work with someone else that is good at selling a complete product and let them do that long term work for them under their own brand instead of Googles or Alphabets.

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u/Drs83 Oct 01 '22

Don't Be Evil Unless It's Not Profitable.

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u/rrrrrroadhouse Oct 01 '22 edited Oct 02 '22

This was always the way it was going to be.

Embrace! Extend! (oh? everybody is on Chromium now?)-- Extinguishhh!

Anyone who trusted goolag not to be evil was fooling themselves.

#AlwaysHasBeenMeme

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u/pain-and-panic Oct 01 '22

Yeah, trust no one, jump ship. Companies will never be loyal to you so you should never feel bad about not being loyal to them.

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u/aChunkyChungus Oct 01 '22

Won’t this just spawn a new generation of ad blocker?

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u/Mediocre-Island5475 Oct 01 '22

Yes and no. People can get around changes like this in the short term, but their goal is to gradually erode the performance and effectiveness of ad blockers until no one uses them.

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u/itchylol742 Oct 01 '22

A giant megacorporation who wants to show ads stands no chance against millions of nerds who really don't want to see ads. Twitch had a back and forth battle with adblockers for quite some time, but it's still possible to block ads on Twitch today.

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u/Fireproof_Matches Oct 01 '22

How do you block ads on Twitch? I noticed that ublock origin didn't seem to work for blocking ads there.

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u/Chansharp Oct 01 '22

Its constantly changing. Its really annoying. Which is funny because instead of just watching the ads I just dont watch twitch anymore.

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u/Olddirtychurro Oct 01 '22

I only watch VODs these days on twitch.

I used to like hopping from stream to stream especially during the release of a new game but having to wait at least 20 seconds every time I switch is too much man, not even TV used to fuck me like that.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '22

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u/ravens52 Oct 01 '22

I feel like I’ve talked to a lot of people recently that have been watching less and less of twitch and more of YouTube vids or Vods instead. Couple that with all of the twitch drama and a lot of people are disinterested in the high school-esque shit that’s constantly going on. It’s better than actual reality tv, but still shitty reality tv.

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u/[deleted] Oct 01 '22

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u/lbs21 Oct 01 '22

This is very optimistic - Google has a lot of power that they're choosing, for business and PR reasons, not to wield. I think that while adblockers, in some form, will always exist, Google could choose to ban all adblocking extensions. Some tech-savvy people might get an ad-blocking VPN, but probably 80% of people wouldn't.

It's not really about making the last, most tech savvy guy see ads. It's about making it hard enough that the average person gives up.

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u/moonra_zk Oct 01 '22

They don't have to stop it completely, just make it annoying enough that the majority of people will stop bothering to block ads.

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u/Sabata11792 Oct 01 '22

I will 100% never use your site again if you threaten my adblockers. I payed for Crunchyroll at some point and they said turn off your adblockers to watch something I paied for. Instantly closed the account and went back to piracy. Dropped Netflix and Chrome for same reasons.

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u/robotikempire Oct 01 '22

Same. Threaten me with ads and I will return to pirating in a second. It is easier and faster than ever anyway.

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u/Uddenfranz Oct 01 '22

It's why I'll never feel ashamed of pirating again in my life. If I pay for a service, and I get told I have to turn something off like my VPN to access the content that I PAID FOR, then fuck you. I'll just use my VPN to access all your shows and all of the seasons for free. Same thing with gaming, I'm not paying 60 dollars for an incomplete game. And I'm not paying however much a month for xbox game pass when the servers are always shit.

Ignoring the fact that pirating is free, if your service is worse than just using my VPN and pirating something.... Why tf should I use it?

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u/WoodTrophy Oct 01 '22

Sort of. Big Tech has tried to stop people on the internet from doing things several times. It never works out. There are far, far more programmers with, ultimately, a massive collective amount of time to work on things compared to all the engineers at google working on chromium.

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u/galleyest Oct 01 '22

Never underestimate the lengths to which a raged out turbo nerd on a forum will go to extract revenge.

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u/WoodTrophy Oct 01 '22

Exactly. The Google engineer goes home every day to spend time with his family among other things. The raged out turbo nerd is sitting at his PC for 18 hours a day.

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u/mindbleach Oct 01 '22

Same shit every time. "It's in the options!" Six months later, "It's in about:config!" Six months later, go fuck yourself.

Anything that requires clever workarounds just to do the bare goddamn minimum should be torn down and replaced.

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u/eladts Oct 01 '22

Won’t this just spawn a new generation of ad blocker?

It already has. uBlock Origin Lite is an experimental ad blocking extension using Manifest V3.

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u/a7iiiShooter Oct 01 '22

Yeah this a total overreaction.

Google probably just wants to make adblocking harder because the average person won’t know how to change it. New adblockers will block ads still, but they know if they completely block those, the advanced users will just leave.

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u/ReeferReekinRight Oct 01 '22 edited Oct 01 '22

I've loved using blokada, it blocks ads at the DNS level by routing traffic thru different DNS like cloudflare or a custom DNS. I use it regularly and on mobile it even blocks ads on apps since all that ad traffic has to communicate with servers.

Edit: Full disclosure; I've used this app since v1, they are on v6. I'm still a grumpy old man staying on v5. But it's a solid ad blocker that my wife also uses and has to have now, and she knows zero about tech.

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u/aChunkyChungus Oct 01 '22

Does it work on iOS? I see a lot of reddit mobile ads and youtube mobile ads that I never see on desktop browser

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u/ReeferReekinRight Oct 01 '22

According to their front page, yes. I will say they now have a pay base option which I don't use. But you can download the .apks from the other versions as it's an open source freeware in those regards.

They do operate a VPN now and that's the "premium service" fyi.

I use a free version of reddit boost and my ads are blocked on the app. Can only expect the same would be for iOS

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u/gitar0oman Oct 01 '22

Sayonara chrome

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u/Clbull Oct 01 '22

The only reason I stopped using Chrome on desktop was because it was a resource hog that was slowing my PC to a crawl. Pleased to report that I haven't had any such problems with Firefox.

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u/PhysicsAndAlcohol Oct 01 '22

Same here. Funny that that's the exact reason I switched from Firefox to Chrome around 2010.

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u/jakmassaker Oct 01 '22

I never stopped using Firefox

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u/p001b0y Oct 01 '22

I never left! I will always be faithful Netsca-I mean, Mozilla!

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u/Valiantheart Oct 01 '22

That's my secret: I never left firefox

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u/[deleted] Oct 01 '22

Expect Google to mess with Firefox by screwing around with Youtube. They won't let you switch.

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u/er0gami2 Oct 01 '22

Never did move from Firefox. Cant trust an advertising company with making web browsers.

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u/superluig164 Oct 01 '22

I've been using Chrome for years and years since it released. I've never wanted to switch, chrome is a fine browser, and all my extensions and settings are synced.

I may finally switch to Firefox after this shit.

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u/korkidog Oct 01 '22

Never left Firefox, so I’ll stay.

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u/csm10495 Oct 01 '22

Is there an easy way to port passwords from chrome over to a Firefox account? I enjoy having them sync from computers to phone, etc.

Enlighten me. :)

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u/neau Oct 01 '22 edited Oct 04 '22 Gold

BitWarden is a cross-browser password manager, I am quite fond of it, give it a try:.

https://bitwarden.com/help/import-data/

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u/DiplomaticGoose Oct 01 '22

Yeah

There's a walkthrough on making a new account to store everything built into the browser, meanwhile the part where everything is copied over from chrome is part of the setup process.

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u/mctoasterson Oct 01 '22

The Manifest v3 transition is going to be the straw that broke the camels back for me. Google willfully built up marketshare with their "free" browser and now that they have 80%+ marketshare they're going to severely hamper our ability to strip out ads and trackers.

I am going to transition away from most of their desktop products and also look into a Graphene OS phone or other privacy solution. Maybe I will keep a sandboxed singleboard PC with a burner account for YouTube purposes...

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u/ralpes Oct 01 '22

I am using 75% FF and 20%, Chrome is only for punch of limited websites. For sure it will become less now, I will just start to use different profiles in FF.

What’s important Mozilla is a non profit. Donate once a year, great software is not coded without costs. Help Mozilla to hire the right folks! I pray that they keep their independence and will not do more deals with cloudflare.

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u/godel32 Oct 01 '22

I've always had Firefox. I've never had any problems with Firefox. I love my privacy on Firefox.

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u/DanteJazz Oct 01 '22

I'm downloading Firefox as we speak.

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u/MisanthropicAtheist Oct 01 '22

Those of us who give a shit have been on Firefox for years already

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u/ahaisonline Oct 01 '22

switched to firefox a couple years ago. never looked back.

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u/habb Oct 01 '22

Time to switch back? I've been using firefox for a few years now

edit: get uBlock Origin and privacy badger. I never see any ads on youtube or anywhere

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u/GanksOP Oct 01 '22

Still need chrome to cast but other than that the swap is worth.

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u/Gasrim Oct 01 '22

Switch back? I've been on Firefox for years already...

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u/Wenuven Oct 01 '22

I was watching a video on this and one of the things mentioned was Firefox naysayers needed to get with the times and stop using old references about website glitches on Firefox.

Firefox has always been my default browser and likely always will be unless their culture shifts drastically. I still in 2022 get website glitches and have to use edge/Chrome for a handful of sites. I'd say it's maybe 5% of my browsing experience.

I'm happy people are leaving Chromium behind, but I want people to know Firefox isn't perfect and you'll need a back up browser occasionally.

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u/[deleted] Oct 01 '22

What websites are you getting glitches on? I've been using Firefox for years on all my devices and I don't recall ever really seeing glitches like you're describing. The only times I've had to switch browsers are for things like Netflix where they have DRM and in the case of Netflix I switch to edge to get 4K. But that's not really a glitch.

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u/Microraptors Oct 01 '22

Not OP but I’ve just done the migration and while I haven’t fully tested why it’s messing up, xfinity(comcast) site to login and pay your internet bill is broken.

I have one credit card with Lowes as well and there are some glitches in there. I had to update my email in the site and whenever I would enter the password to confirm it’s me, something would happen after I hit enter and it would redirect me off the synchrony settings menu to one of their consumer landing pages for their products. So had to switch to chrome to update my email.

So for the 23 sites I have for finances, I’ll need a backup browser for two.

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u/ManDudeGuySirBoy Oct 01 '22

I’ll clue you in from behind the scenes of a web dev company… that’s because quality assurance for Firefox compatibility is never a priority. Firefox views the page upside down but it works in Chrome? Great. Publish it.

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u/AhoyPalloi Oct 01 '22

Obvious point: When the adoption rate of Firefox goes up, that will change.

QA will pay attention if X% of their customers are having a bad experience.

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u/ir34dy0ur3m4i1 Oct 01 '22

I use Firefox as my primary browser, I'd say considerably less than 5% in my experience, maybe once a month, and even then it's usually just when I'm researching something and there are 10,000 other sites I can look at instead of the poorly coded site.

Even when I have more than 1,000 tabs open it doesn't even slow down and I realise that it's time for me to let go and close them even tho FF can handle it lol

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u/misconfigbackspace Oct 01 '22

Even when I have more than 1,000 tabs open

Wait a minute. What? how? Are you secretly a sentient AI?

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u/compelx Oct 01 '22

Probably using browser tab sleeper and a tab tree viewer instead of built-in tabs across the top of the browser. Still, literally a thousand may be hyperbole.

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u/BlueSourBoy Oct 01 '22

I've easily eclipsed over 2000 tabs. It's easy to do, just never close them.

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u/Panda_Watermelon Oct 01 '22

Seek help for your hoarding problem.

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u/Drs83 Oct 01 '22

If a site isn't coded to work with Firefox, I'm not sure I want much to do with it. Most of the time it seems as if it's Firefox's privacy tools that cause the problem. I'm ok with that.

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u/Superunknown_7 Oct 01 '22

coded to work with Firefox

It's less this and more "coded specifically for nonstandard Chrome bullshit" or "reliant on intrusive methods Firefox deliberately rejects." It's like IE6 all over again.

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u/ryecurious Oct 01 '22

coded specifically for nonstandard Chrome bullshit

Like when Slack released video calls, but did it with Chrome's non-standard WebRTC implementation. Meaning it just doesn't work on any non-Chromium browser.

This is why browser monopolies are so bad. A massive megacorp can make a non-standard change and then every other browser either has to agree to the change or lose users.

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u/robotteeth Oct 01 '22

I don't remember there being website glitches, I remember it being horrendously slow and would hog CPU--it slowed my whole computer down noticeably. This was in like 2008ish. I'm back on firefox these days because those problems are long gone, but the issues were legit at the time. I've been back to firefox for at least a year with 0 issues. Once in a blue moon I'll find a site that doesn't want to work with it, but that's on their end. In that case I open chrome, but it's been less and less.

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u/ComputerSong Oct 01 '22

Those 5% of sites work in Firefox when you turn off the ad blocker or loosen the security settings.

This is very telling about Chrome.

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u/nezukotanjiro150 Oct 01 '22

Brave browser and Firefox...it's all I need

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u/ShatteredPixelz Oct 01 '22

Brave is chrome based

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